Not a CBCS member yet? Join now »
CBCS Comics
Not a CBCS member yet? Join now »
KirbyMemorabiliaPop CultureQuestionsSignatures

Need help verifying a Stan Lee, Joe Sinnott and Jack Kirby signature.21263

If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nearmint67
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nearmint67
A friend of mine was one of 3 people that were getting Stan Lee to sign books on the regular.
They had an agreement that they had to spend 10,000.00 per month for Stan to sign with them.
And toward the time before Stan passed, several of the books he signed that were witnessed by these guys, were all rejected.
My friend said "I was standing right in front of him and signed 200 books for me" and several were still rejected. That had to hurt for the amount of cash he paid and them not get verified. Ouch...
He still gets bent years later if someone brings it up...

If they were paying out that kind of money, then they should have had an authorized witness present during the signing.

That's the thing. They were the authorized witness!!!!
Still some of them were rejected. Don't ask me what the flip happened.
His signature was so bad in the last couple of weeks. I don't know what those greedy money hungry boys were thinking. Serves them right though. Should have left the man alone.

That makes absolutely no sense. They either witnessed the signatures or they didn't.
Post 26 IP   flag post
No rust here... Nearmint67 private msg quote post Address this user
I can't argue with there.
I can give the guys number if you would like to chat with him and ask him why...
Post 27 IP   flag post
If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
Nope. That's a can of worms best left to bigger birds.

I know Stan's handler, Max, was forging signatures around the time of his death.
Post 28 IP   flag post
Collector radd76 private msg quote post Address this user
@Darthh8r Look. I grew up in the 80’s and 90’s- it’s not like dozens of companies producing snazzy markers… you had Sharpie and Sharpie and they were the ones pushing the limits not some knockoff- also there was no internet… not sure if you know but Walmarts weren’t “Super” if they had plain ol’ pens you were saying hooraaaaay- you didn’t walk down an aisle and the whole aisle is pens- you’re lucky to have a handful of pens lol- Beckett knows this - they may have been in diapers in the 80’s and early 90’s but they know this stuff.

#2- if the guy that got these signed had a Time Machine and was that much about having a chrome silver marker (not even just the plain silver) on one sig why wouldn’t he have all three signed that way-

#3- Joe Sinnott is your biggest problem (imo) …go look at his sigs… they are super consistent… AND for his sig to be so tiny AND Jack Kirby signature to be so tiny to me it looks like the person that faked these wrote similarly small. Weird that they signed that small and not like almost every Joe and Kirby sig out there-

One thing back in 2020 right before covid broke out here I discussed with their head sig verifier (at CBCS headquarters) and he said a guy is getting REALLY good at faking Stan’s sig- there are getting to be really good fakes out there so I’m saying don’t try his but either Joe or Kirby- those to me are more the clear issue on this one.

I hope you post your results once they are back from Beckett on here?
Post 29 IP   flag post
I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Paint pens were around as early as 1983 so it's possible Jack Kirby signed with one.


Post 30 IP   flag post


Collector radd76 private msg quote post Address this user
@GAC Introduced in 2010


Post 31 IP   flag post
Collector Darthh8r private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by radd76
@Darthh8r Look. I grew up in the 80’s and 90’s- it’s not like dozens of companies producing snazzy markers… you had Sharpie and Sharpie and they were the ones pushing the limits not some knockoff- also there was no internet… not sure if you know but Walmarts weren’t “Super” if they had plain ol’ pens you were saying hooraaaaay- you didn’t walk down an aisle and the whole aisle is pens- you’re lucky to have a handful of pens lol- Beckett knows this - they may have been in diapers in the 80’s and early 90’s but they know this stuff.

#2- if the guy that got these signed had a Time Machine and was that much about having a chrome silver marker (not even just the plain silver) on one sig why wouldn’t he have all three signed that way-

#3- Joe Sinnott is your biggest problem (imo) …go look at his sigs… they are super consistent… AND for his sig to be so tiny AND Jack Kirby signature to be so tiny to me it looks like the person that faked these wrote similarly small. Weird that they signed that small and not like almost every Joe and Kirby sig out there-

One thing back in 2020 right before covid broke out here I discussed with their head sig verifier (at CBCS headquarters) and he said a guy is getting REALLY good at faking Stan’s sig- there are getting to be really good fakes out there so I’m saying don’t try his but either Joe or Kirby- those to me are more the clear issue on this one.

I hope you post your results once they are back from Beckett on here?


You bring up too many good points to dispute, and I should have done better research. I just hope that isnt the case...and yes, I will certainly post the results on here when I get the book back. I did CBCS through my local comic shop.

here is the seller btw. What IS unusual is that he seems to post a lot of Stan Lee signatures and a lot of them are usually with other "Artists". Here are a few images from his listings including his Ebay name. He just posted a new one recently and if this is fake, then its a better fake than what I got...at least they look believeable...







Post 32 IP   flag post
I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by radd76
@GAC Introduced in 2010





Post 33 IP   flag post
Collector radd76 private msg quote post Address this user
@GAC You literally find two (correct) sentences on the internet and you want so badly to connect them lol-

1st yes there were Gel Ink “invented” in Japan in black, red and blue (ONLY) and in the US by 1989. 2nd sentence yes eventually these evolved to metallic gel ink pens in 1997 (3 years after Jack Kirby died).

So again nice try but the sig is fake based not only that it looks like a fake but also there aren’t SILVER METALLIC Jack Kirby’s that are legit to compare to either. If you find one it’s his wife, son or friend that signed them (fakeries).
Post 34 IP   flag post
Collector radd76 private msg quote post Address this user
@GAC

Sakura of America Vice President of Marketing Peter Ouyang explains on the brand’s website, “Not only were we building a brand, but a whole new pen category. I forget how many names went back and forth between Japan and America — we wanted to capture the qualities and essence of this pen in a catchy and descriptive way. We crossed our fingers when we decided on the brand name of Gelly Roll.” So, in 1989, the very first Gelly Roll pens arrived in the United States: A black pen, a blue pen, and a red pen.

Interestingly, though, it wasn’t until nearly a decade later that Gelly Rolls really hit their stride in the United States. During the intervening years, Sakura kept working on new developing kinds of ink for the Gelly Roll, and in 1997, they hit upon something major: An opaque, reflective ink that they used in pens they marketed as Gelly Roll Metallic. Unlike regular Gelly Rolls, Gelly Roll Metallic pens could write on both white and black paper, which made them a real novelty — and they subsequently took off with school kids in a big, big way.

Link is here:

https://www.bustle.com/p/a-complete-written-history-of-the-origins-of-gelly-roll-pens-that-ruled-the-90s-7862812
Post 35 IP   flag post
Collector Darthh8r private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by radd76
@GAC

Sakura of America Vice President of Marketing Peter Ouyang explains on the brand’s website, “Not only were we building a brand, but a whole new pen category. I forget how many names went back and forth between Japan and America — we wanted to capture the qualities and essence of this pen in a catchy and descriptive way. We crossed our fingers when we decided on the brand name of Gelly Roll.” So, in 1989, the very first Gelly Roll pens arrived in the United States: A black pen, a blue pen, and a red pen.

Interestingly, though, it wasn’t until nearly a decade later that Gelly Rolls really hit their stride in the United States. During the intervening years, Sakura kept working on new developing kinds of ink for the Gelly Roll, and in 1997, they hit upon something major: An opaque, reflective ink that they used in pens they marketed as Gelly Roll Metallic. Unlike regular Gelly Rolls, Gelly Roll Metallic pens could write on both white and black paper, which made them a real novelty — and they subsequently took off with school kids in a big, big way.

Link is here:

https://www.bustle.com/p/a-complete-written-history-of-the-origins-of-gelly-roll-pens-that-ruled-the-90s-7862812


What about the uniball um-100? I believe those were released in 1993 or 1994 and the original colors included silver/metallic?

If 1994, that would have been some lucky timing if they released in January (can’t find specific dates) being that Kirby died in February and I’m sure he wasn’t signing a month before he died (I could be wrong) and I can’t find any info on any other companies who were making silver pens aside from the ones already mentioned and aside from outliner markers.
Post 36 IP   flag post
Collector poka private msg quote post Address this user
@Darthh8r sorry - in the CGC board there is thread where books sold by same seller did not pass

https://boards.cgccomics.com/topic/457312-genuine-or-fake-stan-lee-signatures/page/4/#comments
Post 37 IP   flag post
Collector Darthh8r private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by poka
@Darthh8r sorry - in the CGC board there is thread where books sold by same seller did not pass

https://boards.cgccomics.com/topic/457312-genuine-or-fake-stan-lee-signatures/page/4/#comments


Thank you. That’s all I needed. I’m glad someone was already on them. I started a return through eBay so I WILL be getting my money back one way or another. I also had submitted it for a BAS quick review so once it comes back negative I will use that as proof. This guys needs to be reported and taken down.
Post 38 IP   flag post
I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
@Darthh8r I'm happy you found your answer. I still believe it was possible for Jack Kirby to have signed in metallic ink as I remember these types of pens in the 80s. I apologize I didn't thoroughly read your entire first post about this being an eBay purchase....first thing to consider is the ebay seller reputation.

Best of luck and the BAS results should be interesting when received.
Post 39 IP   flag post
Collector radd76 private msg quote post Address this user
@Darthh8r Do not use the Signature Review or screenshots of past items not passing for signatures being “fake”- I have tried this and it was denied by eBay… it falls on “Buyer’s Remorse” and they will say you saw / knew what you were buying- believe me when I say this.

The best thing you can do is look the book over and find crease or stains or staple popped out a little that you couldn’t see in his pics (something to this effect)- even say a tear or rip on page 12 (not in his pictures) -this is how you can be successful with a return.

Also regarding Kirby maybe signing with a pen in 1993 / 1994… those last years were when the fakes happened as his arthritis prevented him from signing and his wife Roz was allowing books to be mailed to their house (getting paid for the signing) and she signed his name. Buying a Kirby signature in PINK METALLIC SPARKLE INK will not get a passing signature EVER-.

If you ever have questions about sigs let me know- I’ve submitted LOTS for me and friends that I submit for so we have been thru many many.
Post 40 IP   flag post
I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthh8r
Quote:
Originally Posted by poka
@Darthh8r sorry - in the CGC board there is thread where books sold by same seller did not pass

https://boards.cgccomics.com/topic/457312-genuine-or-fake-stan-lee-signatures/page/4/#comments


Thank you. That’s all I needed. I’m glad someone was already on them. I started a return through eBay so I WILL be getting my money back one way or another. I also had submitted it for a BAS quick review so once it comes back negative I will use that as proof. This guys needs to be reported and taken down.


Welcome to the forum! I hope you stick around and post pictures of your books and discuss comics...the vast majority of forum members here are very cool and very helpful and not as obnoxious as whats-his-face. Cheers 🍻.
Post 41 IP   flag post
Collector Darthh8r private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthh8r
Quote:
Originally Posted by poka
@Darthh8r sorry - in the CGC board there is thread where books sold by same seller did not pass

https://boards.cgccomics.com/topic/457312-genuine-or-fake-stan-lee-signatures/page/4/#comments


Thank you. That’s all I needed. I’m glad someone was already on them. I started a return through eBay so I WILL be getting my money back one way or another. I also had submitted it for a BAS quick review so once it comes back negative I will use that as proof. This guys needs to be reported and taken down.


Welcome to the forum! I hope you stick around and post pictures of your books and discuss comics...the vast majority of forum members here are very cool and very helpful and not as obnoxious as whats-his-face. Cheers 🍻.


I absolutely will. Also, just got this back, and as expected...it came back negative. So, it looks like a worthless comic with a blue label will be coming my way...


Post 42 IP   flag post
Collector Optic_Blast private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Quote:
Originally Posted by radd76
@sportshort it’s hard to sign something when you are dead… just saying. Jack Kirby passed away in 1995… I’ve never seen a metallic silver Jack Kirby ever before… he signed with black ball point pen most of the time. I have seen blue ballpoint pen as well less frequently. It also looks fake (so two strikes against it).






Pentel has made paint pens since the '80s. Including silver.
Doesn't look like a Sharpie signature either. Too inconsistent.


There was another company that made them in the early 90s. I had a Faust #1 signed by Vigil right around the time issue #3 came out. I don't remember who made it but it was a marker you had to shake back and forth to mix the paint. I remember handing vigil the marker, without shaking the pen, and as soon as he put the to on the cover a glop of thinner and metallic paint spilled onto the cover.
Post 43 IP   flag post
Collector radd76 private msg quote post Address this user
@Optic_Blast Yeah early 90’s were the last few years he lived and suffering from arthritis. Also the specific book posted looks like it would have been a fairly thin point metallic silver marker (highly doubtful Kirby would sign with this type of pen sitting at his house in poor health after signing with ballpoint pens on the inside splash pages the majority of his life).

Also we have shown this is a fake by multiple sources - eBay seller has sold other fakes and it has been reviewed by BAS and others and posted here.

If anyone wants to buy a Jack Kirby signed in metallic silver ink hit me up I’ll sell you one. I’ve also got some ocean front property in Arizona I’ll make you a bundle deal. 🤣
Post 44 IP   flag post
Collector Darthh8r private msg quote post Address this user
Good news everyone, and a major update!

My local comic shop just saved my a$$ big time. I went down there today to see if they had sent the comic to CBCS in the hopes that maybe I could intercept it in time if they didnt and to get my refund from eBay. LUCKILY it was still there, and they hadnt sent it out yet because they were moving inventory the past couple weeks.

So, I got the comic back, sent it back to that SOB on eBay, and I basically got my refund back for the grading and will be getting a full refund from eBay. Lesson learned! Now, hopefully the Bob Kane signature turns out to be legit.

P.S. - Is anyone having issues signing into the CBCS home page? I can only navigate the forums but for some reasons I cannot login and it keeps saying, "Verifying" but won't let me sign in and CBCS said theres nothing happening on their end. Anyone else having this problem? I cant sign in to see my orders.

Thanks everyone!
-Andrew
Post 45 IP   flag post
If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user

Post 46 IP   flag post
If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
I can sign in and see my dashboard without issue.
Post 47 IP   flag post
I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Same...I can.login and see my dashboard.
Post 48 IP   flag post
I got screwed six ways to Sunday. sborock_ComicLink private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
Nope. That's a can of worms best left to bigger birds.

I know Stan's handler, Max, was forging signatures around the time of his death.


Max was a con man who took huge advantage of Stan and ripped him off as well as making Stan sign while he needed rest but kept pushing him to sign longer and much longer to make money (CASH!) off this great man!

I called Max out on the convention floor and told Max that if he did not stop a signing, at the time to let Stan rest, I would call him out right then and there in front of Stans fans. Max, that POS, was scared and let me take Stan to the green room to rest. Max has been sued and will hopefully go to prison and hell.

RIP Stan The Man.☮
Post 49 IP   flag post
Collector CapCityComics private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthh8r
Good news everyone, and a major update!

My local comic shop just saved my a$$ big time. I went down there today to see if they had sent the comic to CBCS in the hopes that maybe I could intercept it in time if they didnt and to get my refund from eBay. LUCKILY it was still there, and they hadnt sent it out yet because they were moving inventory the past couple weeks.

So, I got the comic back, sent it back to that SOB on eBay, and I basically got my refund back for the grading and will be getting a full refund from eBay. Lesson learned! Now, hopefully the Bob Kane signature turns out to be legit.

P.S. - Is anyone having issues signing into the CBCS home page? I can only navigate the forums but for some reasons I cannot login and it keeps saying, "Verifying" but won't let me sign in and CBCS said theres nothing happening on their end. Anyone else having this problem? I cant sign in to see my orders.

Thanks everyone!
-Andrew

Despite the circumstances, that's awesome news! I checked that seller's account on eBay, and it appears any and all comic books he had listed are now either gone or taken down.
Post 50 IP   flag post
623197 50 25
Log in or sign up to compose a reply.