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CBCS GradedQuestions

Submitting to CBCS: A Newbie's Guide9896

COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
I definitely feel that the first big company to establish overseas operations, whether in Asia or Europe, will get a huge leg up on the competition.
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Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by dielinfinite
I definitely feel that the first big company to establish overseas operations, whether in Asia or Europe, will get a huge leg up on the competition.


Definitely. The conglomerates saw that from Day one. Disney, Universal, etc -- they been investing heavily in Asia. Back in the day only Japan mostly and some in Hong Kong, but now also Singapore and with heavy emphasis - China.

The Philippines, where I'm in right now, has a very strong American comic book market. Very strong. People grew up here watching and reading everything American. So American books are like a natural pastime thing. It's not 'foreign' or 'strange' to the people here. There is no need for story adjustments and there's no need for language translation. Of course when you got the books, the next thing is to have it graded. So...

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Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
Loving this ultra clean Beckett slab!




I know to get this is through Beckett, obviously, Thats the most straight forward way.
But since Beckett is the umbrella company of CBCS, is there a way to get this kind of slab through a CBCS facilitator? Because I have yet to meet a Beckett facilitator in my country.
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COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
I know in the past CBCS has accepted a Beckett Verification for their own red label so I would hope it flows the other way too and a CBCS AW could witness for Beckett.

I would call/email Beckett and ask. It may end up being as simple as the AW writing their authorization code on the Beckett invoice
Post 29 IP   flag post
Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by dielinfinite
I know in the past CBCS has accepted a Beckett Verification for their own red label so I would hope it flows the other way too and a CBCS AW could witness for Beckett.

I would call/email Beckett and ask. It may end up being as simple as the AW writing their authorization code on the Beckett invoice


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Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
More questions.

If a fan made a fan art and have it signed by the creator would CBCS encapsulate it with the ART label? Or what label does that fall under? Art not done by the creator but has the creator's signature.
Post 31 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
@Red_Blade Remember, books aren’t automatically sorted into specific labels. Books are labelled according to what the customer decides on the order form, within a few restrictions.

That book you describe could go in a blue label with a hit to the grade for the sketch and the signature. It could go in a yellow label if the proper steps are taken for the signature and the sketch. It can go in a red label if the signature is verified after the fact. Any of the above can be graded or ART and as long as the proper steps are followed and reported honestly, none of the above options will specifically say that the creator did the sketch the fan did.
Post 32 IP   flag post
Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks! I was thinking more along the lines of say sketch on a backing board or a piece of paper. Doesn't CBCS encapsulate those types of things? If so that'd automatically fall under ART, right?

So as I understand CBCS would verify the creator's sig and encapsulate regardless of whether he did the sketch or not?

Also, not all artists are sketch artists. Especially in today's digital times. Suppose an artist is known for his 'Photoshop' work on magazine covers. Could he Photoshop something, print it out, sign it and have it encapsulated by CBCS? Could that still get say the Art label? Cos technically its also art, right?
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Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
There are certainly non-comic book examples, like https://www.ebay.com/itm/Jim-Steranko-Nick-Fury-Head-Sketch-Art-CBCS-Authentic-Art-and-Signature-Marvel-/232645831283 (just one that came up in google results). I don't think their description is accurate in terms of CBCS verifying the sketch; they just verify the signature. I imagine some other print like you describe would work too as long as it fits in the holder.
Post 34 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
@Red_Blade

@xkonk is correct. They will slab non-book items like sheets of paper or backing boards. I can’t see why they couldn’t slab something pre-printed (that’s basically what comics are). I’d imagine the label would only indicate the signature and omit the “sketch on board” part
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Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks y'all!
Post 36 IP   flag post
Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
I've spoken to a few people who had their books signed by a LCS owner because the books were 'store exclusive variants' at his store - they wanted it to be more memorable and so had the store owner sign them. When they submitted them to CBCS (at least according to their story) they came back with the signatures counting against the grades. It's understandable as CBCS wouldn't know everyone.

But is there a way to let CBCS know that "don't count X signature against the grade of a book" because "X person was involved to a certain degree in bringing the book to collectors?"
Post 37 IP   flag post
Moderator Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user
@Red_Blade Well, unless you have someone who is famous as a lcs owner, the verified option is out.

One thing you can try to do is get someone there who can become a facilitator and maybe he could witness the signings and submit them to CBCS for the yellow label.

Another option would be for the lcs to have a store event and the people who want the owners signature would have to apply to be authorized witnesses for that event. Then they can witness him signing their own books and get them in a yellow label.

I believe there is a third option, where the owner would have to fill out a form that would accompany the comic to CBCS stating that he signed it and what his involvement was. I don't know if he would then submit them or if the customers could submit them. I've only heard of this happening and have never done it myself.

All these are possible options for the future. The ones that are already graded are not eligible for any of these options as the chain of custody is not there.

My suggestion is to do the last one, but you need to contact CBCS about the technical way that is to be done.

One thing to consider is to see if you can convince a lcs owner to become a CBCS facilitator. It may well be worth his time and effort. If I understand correctly, he can have employees witness signings also, he does not need to be physically there each time. Plus, he could add the option of grading at any signings that his store may do. In fact, you do not need to have a brick and mortar store to be a facilitator, but there are submission guidelines that need to be met. Again, CBCS would be who you'd need to contact about that. But if you let them know you want to set up a facilitator in the Philippines, they may work with you.
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Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
@Jesse_O Awesome! Very informative and helpful!

Think I might go with either option 1 or 3 if I get a book signed by an LCS owner. Will also drop CBCS an e-mail for the technicalities as you suggested. Thanks!
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COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
@Red_Blade Basically everything @Jesse_O said!

Additionally, I think it’s worth breaking down what is happening in the story you conveyed.

Basically, the LCS owner’s signature was an unwitnessed signature since there wasn’t an AW present. Unwitnessed signatures count against the grade unless they are verified and verification is unlikely for some random store owner’s signature.

As I understand it, a person doesn’t actually have to be involved with a book to be listed on a yellow label (or if they do then it can be VERY tenuous), the signing just has to be witnessed by an Authorized Witnessed.

What you described, “don’t count so-and-so against the grade,” is very reminiscent of CGC’s Qualified (green) label. Before CBCS’ red label was an option collectors basically had to take the hit on a blue label or go for a green label, which ignores a major flaw on the book, in this case the unwitnessed signature.

The problem with the green label is that the label just says “name written on cover,” which is hardly satisfying for a signature collector, nor does it differentiate between a genuine but unwitnessed signature, a forged signature, or random writing on the cover. Additionally, since green labels ignore a major flaw on a book they are also used on books with missing pages or other serious damage but still get high grades so there is real uncertainty as to what the actual grade would be if all those flaws were taken into account.
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Collector Red_Blade private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by dielinfinite

As I understand it, a person doesn’t actually have to be involved with a book to be listed on a yellow label (or if they do then it can be VERY tenuous), the signing just has to be witnessed by an Authorized Witnessed.


Very interesting...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dielinfinite

What you described, “don’t count so-and-so against the grade,” is very reminiscent of CGC’s Qualified (green) label. Before CBCS’ red label was an option collectors’ basically had to take the hit on a blue label or go for a green label, which ignores a major flaw on the book, in this case the unwitnessed signature.

The problem with the green label is that the label just says “name written on cover,” which is hardly satisfying for a signature collector, nor does it differentiate between a genuine but unwitnessed signature, a forged signature, or random writing on the cover. Additionally, since green labels ignore a major flaw on a book they are also used on books with missing pages or other series damage but still get high grades so there is real uncertainty as to what the actual grade would be if all those flaws were taken into account.


I personally think the green label is a scam. Maybe not the exact word but I can't think of any other word to describe it right now. It's just them tapping into the "damaged books" and "missing pages" market by getting those owners to submit their books since they can now also get 9.8's (albeit under a different colored label).

Also the people who got their books signed by the LCS owner -- the ones I'm talking about in my OP -- they just didn't research enough and didn't know to have the LCS owner's signing witnessed.
From what I understand there were CBCS facilitators around when it happened -- it was a signing event with some artists. They had the books signed by the artists first (witnessed) THEN approached the LCS owner to get his signature as well, just before sending them in for grading.
So I think the books returned with yellow labels (because of the witnessed artist sigs) BUT the one signature CBCS couldn't identify (which was the LCS owner's) counted as damage. Or at least that's my assumption.
Post 41 IP   flag post
Collector Arak private msg quote post Address this user
So , I have never bought a pro grade in 50 years, but hey you can teach old..d er roguishly handsome, slightly seasoned and ever oh so humble dog new tricks

my brethren , I submit for your perusal . Do you think these 2 would make good starters? I am sorry about the quality. battery needed charging on camera, so I took these with my phone. thank you in advance for your advise and grade and should I send them to be Pro pressed? I mean they are pretty flat . also should I send in groups of 5 ? 10 ? 25 ?








Post 42 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
@Arak The books look to be in very good condition; though without good shots of the spines it’s difficult to estimate the grade.

One of the books seems to have a little waviness on the bottom of the back cover, almost looks like water damage, supported by what looks like staining on the inside pages. This will hurt the grade significantly. A press should be able to flatten out the back cover but the staining will remain and hurt the grade quite a bit.
Post 43 IP   flag post
Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
Following on @dielinfinite, pressing isn't just about flatness. Or at least just because a book lays flat, doesn't mean there isn't something to press. Waviness, small bends and creases, things like that might not be super obvious but might be removed with pressing. CBCS pressing also does some dry cleaning, so they can remove some marks but not everything.
Post 44 IP   flag post
Collector Arak private msg quote post Address this user
wow ! you both are just so awesome. I love my new friends.
OK so I need spine shots if I hear you both.. clean press grade... the full monty for my 1 st go
I tell you at my age and my experience of nothing but raw until this very year, and then feeling like a newb at 55. you both took the time to answer and salved some of the ignorance blues I was feeling . I will get the better pictures to you muy pronto
Post 45 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
@Arak You’re very welcome. One important thing to remember is that pressing a book does not necessarily mean the book will grade better. Pressing addresses certain flaws but not others.

Think of pressing like ironing a shirt. If the shirt is wrinkled the ironing will make it look great but ironing won’t do much to fix a tear.

Additionally, a book’s grade is a reflection of it’s accumulated flaws, so while a press can help a book look better, the remaining flaws may prevent the grade from increasing
Post 46 IP   flag post
Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
@Arak ditto what @dielinfinite said again. If you're specifically interested in a grade increase instead of the book just presenting better, use press screening. CBCS will only press it if they think it will go up in grade.
Post 47 IP   flag post
Collector Arak private msg quote post Address this user
well again I find myself dipping my bucket into ya'lls well of wisdom.. I was embarrassed that I didnt even know how to give ya'll good picture . but I took some with the camera and I think these combined with the previous should do the trick.

Dielinfinite - I am catching what your stressin, I am picking up what your putting down. the book is like me. At this stage with all the accumulated injuries and titanium pieces ... no amount of pressing will make me healthier.. but a nice TUX might dress me up a bit

Xkonk I am ways off from full inventory but figure its a no brainer to sell of the 2nd and or 3rd copy . So for these my goal is increase the sales price and get a little more liquid
Between the new purchases, the t-moble/sprint stock ( so close to being finally done with the merger)the cryptocurrency and that 8K hit for a full replacement of central a/c the other day. *snap* and that crazy ass gaming rig... things are skinny from what I am use to. I need more wiggle room. so its sell a few now or sell one of those bitcoins and i do not want to do that.. I am from country and I thought it was a big deal to have 4 LMAO the guy next to me on binance.US this morning had 4000 DAYAAAAAm

oh right ...the pictures











Post 48 IP   flag post
Collector Arak private msg quote post Address this user
OK I put together some books I would like to submit for my first shot at 3rd party grading.
Is there a submission min/max for a cost effective sweet spot ?
Should I go pay for a membership first?

Thank you for your help
Post 49 IP   flag post
Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
Sending multiple books at a time helps to even out the shipping cost per book, but the cost is still generally going to go up with more books because of the weight and insurance. Definitely separate out books that are going to pressing before grading if you're doing that because they go to different places.

Also think about separating out books by the grading tier. Moderns and expanded have the same turnaround time, but if you get something into the 2-day modern or quickstream price range they will be graded faster. But CBCS holds all the books in an order together until the slowest one is done. If you have some moderns and some 2-day moderns and want the 2-days back as soon as they're done, you can send it all together in one box but you need to make two orders so they ship back to you separately.

A membership is worthwhile in two cases a) if you can use the coupons and/or b) if you're going to send enough books that the member discount adds up for you.

For A, for example, a gold membership gets you 2 for 1 on a one-day grading. If you aren't sending anything for one-day grading, that level of membership isn't doing anything for you. I usually send moderns of not-that-high value so I get a bronze membership when I need to renew. Keep in mind that if you use the coupon you might have different tiers like I described above.

For B, the coupons are basically the cost of the membership so if you use the coupons the member discount is gravy. If you got a bronze membership but never use the coupons, you need to send 50 books in a year to break even. $2 discount per book times 50 books = $100 membership fee. If you're doing other stuff like fast pass that gets a discount then the number of books changes a bit but the idea still stands.
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Collector rtdcomics private msg quote post Address this user
Does anyone know the current time allowance between getting a book signed and into CBCS for yellow label?

Had a few signed recently but due to a previous label error (and waiting for an email response/resolve) I didnt send them off straight away (presuming I would send together with the incorrect label slab return) but think I've now missed the timescale.

Thanks
Post 51 IP   flag post
CBCS President sborock private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by rtdcomics
Does anyone know the current time allowance between getting a book signed and into CBCS for yellow label?

Had a few signed recently but due to a previous label error (and waiting for an email response/resolve) I didnt send them off straight away (presuming I would send together with the incorrect label slab return) but think I've now missed the timescale.

Thanks


Please email me all important info about this and I will try and help you. sborock@cbcscomics.com
Post 52 IP   flag post
Collector Arak private msg quote post Address this user
Konk Quote:
Originally Posted by xkonk
Sending multiple books at a time helps to even out the shipping cost per book, but the cost is still generally going to go up with more books because of the weight and insurance. Definitely separate out books that are going to pressing before grading if you're doing that because they go to different places.

Also think about separating out books by the grading tier. Moderns and expanded have the same turnaround time, but if you get something into the 2-day modern or quickstream price range they will be graded faster. But CBCS holds all the books in an order together until the slowest one is done. If you have some moderns and some 2-day moderns and want the 2-days back as soon as they're done, you can send it all together in one box but you need to make two orders so they ship back to you separately.

A membership is worthwhile in two cases a) if you can use the coupons and/or b) if you're going to send enough books that the member discount adds up for you.

For A, for example, a gold membership gets you 2 for 1 on a one-day grading. If you aren't sending anything for one-day grading, that level of membership isn't doing anything for you. I usually send moderns of not-that-high value so I get a bronze membership when I need to renew. Keep in mind that if you use the coupon you might have different tiers like I described above.

For B, the coupons are basically the cost of the membership so if you use the coupons the member discount is gravy. If you got a bronze membership but never use the coupons, you need to send 50 books in a year to break even. $2 discount per book times 50 books = $100 membership fee. If you're doing other stuff like fast pass that gets a discount then the number of books changes a bit but the idea still stands.


Dang Xkonk ,
Thank you for such a great and informative response. It made my ol beat up hands hurt just thinking about that much typing.

For what its worth. I crumbled in the face of adversity.
I locked up and went defcon 2 .
I forgot the face of my father.
I am afraid Mr. Miyagi, I'm Afraid
“It’s OK to lose to opponent, must not lose to fear.”

Ok that might be a bit dramatic . I had sticker shock for my first 7 books at a time when I should be selling others, Or hell maybe my math is off... probably
Either way. I will strengthen my conviction and climb that hill next week
Post 53 IP   flag post
Collector flanders private msg quote post Address this user
If I mail one order to FL for pressing & grading and another order to TX for grading only, can the grading only order be held so that return shipping for both orders can be combined? If so how would I go about doing this?
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COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
No for the same reasons CBCS requires pressed and non-pressed books on separate invoices. The logistics of matching orders from two different locations and/or holding books to not be pressed at one location or holding completed books for over a month (standard tat vs pressing tat) at the other was not something they wanted to deal with.
Post 55 IP   flag post
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