blunted gloss question929
 Collector
|
jmh722 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi, I have a really pretty ASM 129 but there is loss of gloss around one of the staples. Can anyone tell me what that means? Is it rubbing? Water? Restoration? Attaching a link to a photo. https://www.dropbox.com/sc/m5474qqp386ptxa/AAAGtTovPGVWStbAjijAsz3xa Thanks |
||
| Post 1 • IP flag post | ||
 You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Something rubbed it. Nothing you can do. | ||
| Post 2 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
jmh722 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| But it's not restoration? That's my primary concern. | ||
| Post 3 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
|
MR_SigS private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The paper looks nice and white and the staple looks nice, so I don't think it's restored unless some kind of stain was erased. | ||
| Post 4 • IP flag post | ||
 CBCS broke up with me over Facebook.
|
CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Doesn't look to be restored, but I see an area that looks dull. Does look like an attempt to clean something off was made. | ||
| Post 5 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
|
SilverAgeFan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Which brings up another question: is just cleaning off a stain, spot of say, coffee, a speck of dirt or something like that considered "restoration"? Your not necessarily attempting to bring back the gloss, replacing something missing or worn out, you are just trying to remove something that was not supposed to be there in the first place. |
||
| Post 6 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Restoration is adding, fixing, color touching etc...conservation is persevering an item, so lifting of dirts and soils, pressing. Using items to clean a comic or paper item can remove gloss if used too heavily, such as absorene, wall paper eraser etc. Often people use a common eraser on a comic and it may remove pencil or light soiling but inadvertently removes gloss leaving a worse problem than before. Adding gloss back to an area, if it could be done, would be seen as restoration, as you are trying to bring it back to its original print state. |
||
| Post 7 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by earthshaker01 Pressing is conservation? LOL, that's a good one. I don't even think professional pressers would agree with that. Edit for CGC definition... "Conservation Repairs Conservation repairs are performed with the intent of preserving the structural or chemical integrity of a comic book using professional techniques and materials. It excludes aesthetic repairs such as color touch and piece fill. All conserved grades must satisfy the CGC quality scale of "A" and quantity scale of "1"." |
||
| Post 8 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
SilverAgeFan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @earthshaker01, Thanks! I've often wondered exactly what the differences between conservation and restoration are. It seems like there are two things to be considered. There is a fine line between them and anything you might consider doing to the book itself, check with the professionals first and also let the professionals do the work. |
||
| Post 9 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan This might belp... https://www.cgccomics.com/news/viewarticle.aspx?IDArticle=4084 |
||
| Post 10 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
SilverAgeFan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @CCD, Wow! That's some great information and answers a lot of questions. | ||
| Post 11 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @CCD the industry set the standard not me | ||
| Post 12 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
@SilverAgeFan Quote:Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan That's your best bet. |
||
| Post 13 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by CCD Oh no not another cgc article aren't those the guys with all the problems of late. |
||
| Post 14 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
SilverAgeFan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It would be interesting to see if CBCS Also has guidelines for restoration versus conservation. I'm sure they have something. I wonder if they would be willing to share it with us? | ||
| Post 15 • IP flag post | ||
 -Our Odin-Rest in Peace |
Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user | |
| This is from the CBCS faq section on the website. "Before a comic book is graded, it is checked for restoration or conservation by our restoration detection experts. CBCS has separated conservation and a restoration into two different categories. If restoration or conservation is found, CBCS will include a list of all the work detected on the label, classifying it as either conserved or restored. CBCS has 5 levels of restoration; slight, slight to moderate, moderate, moderate to extensive, and extensive. The more restoration that is detected, the higher the restoration level becomes. Books that have both restoration and conservation will receive the restoration designation." |
||
| Post 16 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by earthshaker01 Did you see my edit and the CGC quote? CGC, who set the standard as you say, says that aesthetic repairs do not count as conservation. This includes pressing. Pressing is not conservation. The point is moot though because CGC doesn't identify pressing if done right. |
||
| Post 17 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by earthshaker01 Steve Borock help set those standards so I don't see what the problem is. Those guidelines are spelled out better than CBCS' are, but since Steve was the president of both companies I think they'd line up pretty well. |
||
| Post 18 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
SilverAgeFan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Thank you for the information Jesse. That helps explain a lot. In essence, it seems like it boils down quite simply to if something is added to bring a book back to near pristine that is restoration, if something is removed to bring a book back to near pristine, that is conservation. There's an ongoing debate about pressing being restoration or not. Means going back to my earlier simple definition, you are removing something. Wrinkles, folds, bends and the like. |
||
| Post 19 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan I would say that definition does not work because you can add stuff to books and it's still conservation. The bottom of that CGC link i gave you explains. I thnk one of the main components of Conservation is that any work done can be undone without hurting the book. Conservation Repairs Conservation repairs are performed with the intent of preserving the structural or chemical integrity of a comic book using professional techniques and materials. It excludes aesthetic repairs such as color touch and piece fill. All conserved grades must satisfy the CGC quality scale of "A" and quantity scale of "1". Tear seals Spine split seals Reinforcement Piece reattachment Some cover or interior cleaning (water or solvent) Staples cleaned or replaced Some leaf casting De-acidification Materials Used for Conservation Repairs: Rice paper Wheat glue Vintage staples Archival tape |
||
| Post 20 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
SilverAgeFan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @CCD, Thanks again! Once again that proves to me that I need to read very closely and pay very close attention. | ||
| Post 21 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan We all do!  Misinformation is the bane of our hobby. |
||
| Post 22 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| There is a way to return some gloss to a book in small areas like you showed without detection. I have a relative who has been doing restoration for decades who gave me some insight. I'll get the details when I see her in a few weeks and if this subject comes up again I'll explain what I learn. | ||
| Post 23 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SilverAgeFan I would not recommend restoring any book that doesn't have significant value. Most collectors treat restored.books like the plauge. If you do do it male sure it's worth the money it would cost and know that you might limit the amount of people who want to buy it. |
||
| Post 24 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
CCD private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by earthshaker01 That would be some great info, it would help the resto experts at CBCS detect it better. |
||
| Post 25 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
MR_SigS private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by CCD Hope so. So unfortunate to hear people trying to deceive collectors. |
||
| Post 26 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
jmh722 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'd love to hear how it's done too. Recently I had a resto issue with a less than scrupulous dealer. | ||
| Post 27 • IP flag post | ||
|
CBCS broke up with me over Facebook.
|
CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by earthshaker01 It is a rather simple process. Impossible to detect if done right. |
||
| Post 28 • IP flag post | ||
|
You think I'm joking, I'm not.
|
earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Went and saw aunt (30+ year book restorer) She showed me what and how to use the product some artists use to put a gloss on their paintings. Its an acrylic medium, it comes in gloss and matte. Its easy to use, mainly to blend leather surfaces. Her specialty is extremely old books and documents. With that being said. You wouldn't use it straight out of the bottle on a comic or magazine. There is a technique she taught me last week that seemed to work superbly on some old magazines I had. Another issue is the older you go on a book, magszine, or comic you need to research what type of paper and if the book even had gloss on it or not when originally made. Obviously newer comics are glossy and on the mags we did it on it was quite easy and not detectable even uder a black light or other lights and angles. It's not appropriate to explain how to use it or the techniques when applying it for a variety of reasons. One being I wouldn't want to have someone try it and screw up their books. Second, it's best done by a professional to insure it's done properly as application involves quantity applied, thinning of material to be applied, room temp to make a smoothing affect, so it's not standing out like a sore thumb once dry etc...For me it was easy to learn because of who taught me, but it's not just as simple as slapping it on and calling it good. Lastly people have businesses to restore books and conserve them so I wouldn't want to take business away from people who put the time in to learn restoration techniques. |
||
| Post 29 • IP flag post | ||
|
Collector
|
jmh722 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| So if done right, you wouldn't be able to determine it anyway? | ||
| Post 30 • IP flag post | ||
This topic is archived. Start new topic?