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AOC YAY OR NAY8700

Thick Skinned OGJackster private msg quote post Address this user
We aren't talking about slavery. In reference to today, it gives smaller states a say. Otherwise, if we went by popular vote, the very liberal, larger states would be picking the Presidents thus making smaller states obsolete. That's the argument.
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Collector michaelekrupp private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by OGJackster
We aren't talking about slavery. In reference to today, it gives smaller states a say. Otherwise, if we went by popular vote, the very liberal, larger states would be picking the Presidents thus making smaller states obsolete. That's the argument.


What he said.
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COLLECTOR kaptainmyke private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by doog
Too late to get a Reagan’s Raiders signed



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Collector IronMan private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by OGJackster
We aren't talking about slavery. In reference to today, it gives smaller states a say. Otherwise, if we went by popular vote, the very liberal, larger states would be picking the Presidents thus making smaller states obsolete. That's the argument.

But it's not true

Every State gets two Senators. Wyoming - with a population of less than 600,000. And California with a population of almost FORTY million. Both get two US Senators.

This makes sure small States have an equal voice. Plus Senate rules that while recently trampled upon (recent, like the last 10 years) make it difficult to do anything controversial with less than the support of 60 Senators.

The EC long ago lived out it's usefulness. ALL that is necessary for it to go into the history books if for Republicans to lose a Presidential election in the EC but win on the popular vote.

A lot of Republcans seem to believe the EC favors the GOP, so put partisan politics ahead of principles of Democracy. But that's not actually true. It's just how it has worked out the last 20 years.

If Al Gore had recieved 60,000 more votes in Ohio in 2004, he would have been elected President. Even though he trailed in the popular vote by three million to George W. Bush.

So we will see the end of all the nonsensical defense of the EC when the GOP gets screwed over. And that will happen, probably in the next 20-30 years.
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I'll probably wake up constipated. Pre_Coder private msg quote post Address this user
This thread is going to get locked,.. pretty much a given as most threads relating to religion / politics. But there really is a positive side to discussions such as this. We are not just a comic book collecting society, we are also a social media family here. Agree or disagree,.. with diplomacy, tact, and understanding, we can become closer, and without egos blinding us, respect and understanding for each other as well.

Positive results can be achieved in threads such as this.
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Collector IronMan private msg quote post Address this user
People don't think deeply enough about the Electoral College. Eliminating it would be a good thing in a lot of ways.

Right now, candidates for the Presidency run their campaigns focused on a dozen - really about eight - States. It's a waste for Democratic OR Republican candidates to spend much time and money in California or Texas. They already KNOW how those States will vote. Extra votes obtained for either party are wasted.

With a nation wide popular vote, every single vote matters equally. Yes, as a Democrat you can expect to lose in Texas. But if you work hard and get an extra 250,000 votes above the "norm" than that is important. It matters. And same for a Republican candidate in California.

This "every vote matters" rather than 8-12 State matters would encourage citizen participation in elections. Which is low compared to most other countries. I live in Indiana. Solid red. Doesn't really matter if I vote in the Presidential election most years. The outcome is known. So we see very little in the way of stops by candidates. Very little in the way of adverting or outreach. Presidential candidates spend their time and money in the swing States next door of Ohio and Pennsylvania and Wisconsin.
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Collector michaelekrupp private msg quote post Address this user
Unfortunately I have to jet for work. Very much enjoyed the conversation, gents.
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COLLECTOR shrewbeer private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
People don't think deeply enough about the Electoral College. Eliminating it would be a good thing in a lot of ways.

Right now, candidates for the Presidency run their campaigns focused on a dozen - really about eight - States. It's a waste for Democratic OR Republican candidates to spend much time and money in California or Texas. They already KNOW how those States will vote. Extra votes obtained for either party are wasted.

With a nation wide popular vote, every single vote matters equally. Yes, as a Democrat you can expect to lose in Texas. But if you work hard and get an extra 250,000 votes above the "norm" than that is important. It matters. And same for a Republican candidate in California.

This "every vote matters" rather than 8-12 State matters would encourage citizen participation in elections. Which is low compared to most other countries. I live in Indiana. Solid red. Doesn't really matter if I vote in the Presidential election most years. The outcome is known. So we see very little in the way of stops by candidates. Very little in the way of adverting or outreach. Presidential candidates spend their time and money in the swing States next door of Ohio and Pennsylvania and Wisconsin.


These are all valid points.

I would however interject that the electoral college is a valid failsafe against the very poorly informed and unintelligent general masses. For that it is invaluable, and the closer to idiocracy we get, the more we need it.
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Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelekrupp
@IronMan I can not see any way that the less populated states would not suffer by changing the electoral college system. The main reason that the system exists is so more populated states cannot dictate policy for the entire country.


Small states Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Rhode Island, and Vermont (and maybe more depending on what you consider small, and non-state DC) apparently aren't concerned. https://www.nationalpopularvote.com/
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