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A personalized exchange w/ Jeromy Murray, VP of CBCS & Beckett.7761

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Collector 750	750 Broker1 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 2
	Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament Update Reply from Mr. Murray: "Mr. (BabaLament), Thank you for the response & comments. We will pull your order and have it shipped back by tomorrow. The (remaining money) will be refunded back to your credit card, once the order ships, and will show up in 3-5 business days (depending on your bank). Again, we are sorry that we could not provide the service you desired and hope we get a chance to work with you in the future. Have a great day! Jeromy Murray \| Vice President, Beckett Grading/Authentication & CBCS" TAT for books: 22+ weeks. TAT for disappointment: 24hrs, +/- 3-5 business days. The "remaining" money?
	5 years ago	Post 26 • IP flag post

Collector 2.12K	2.12K Wraith private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 2
	Quote: Originally Posted by Broker1 Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament Update Reply from Mr. Murray: "Mr. (BabaLament), Thank you for the response & comments. We will pull your order and have it shipped back by tomorrow. The (remaining money) will be refunded back to your credit card, once the order ships, and will show up in 3-5 business days (depending on your bank). Again, we are sorry that we could not provide the service you desired and hope we get a chance to work with you in the future. Have a great day! Jeromy Murray \| Vice President, Beckett Grading/Authentication & CBCS" TAT for books: 22+ weeks. TAT for disappointment: 24hrs, +/- 3-5 business days. The "remaining" money? exactly my thoughts. Pulling their costs at customers own expense for customer not receiving what they paid for upfront is not good practice. Certainly not inspired me to race some orders out the door.
	5 years ago	Post 27 • IP flag post

Collector 2.96K	2.96K BabaLament private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 3
	@Broker1 No, no; nothing like that. Two of the books were two day moderns that we’re on a different order form; they ended up shipped far in advance, instead of with the Moderns like normal. I have those books in my possession. It was an in-person submission, so even though it was two separate order forms, they only swiped the credit card once. To be clear, the remainder is what remains after accounting for the two books in my possession. No financial shenanigans whatsoever; everything on the money end has been entirely above-board and on point. If accurate information regarding TAT’s had been available at the time the order was placed, the entire order would have been on the 2-day tier, and this thread would not exist.
	5 years ago	Post 28 • IP flag post

Collector 11.12K	11.12K MR_SigS private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by nrad What a pathetic response, even after your letter and 22+wk delay he can't even give you a completion date or other gesture to try to remedy the situation. And the whole "The dates you were given were estimates, not guaranteed dates or turnaround" could never stand in the current situation. It would be the equivalent of saying that contrary to their advertised TAT, they can take as long as they want. Quote: Originally Posted by MR_SigS I'm not sure he could have given any more of a firm estimate of completion than is already given without moving books ahead of others, which they won't do of course. You mean "any more firm" than the worthless/inaccurate estimate that was given? You are admitting that they are incapable of giving an estimate (even now after 22+ wks), and you think that's acceptable...well nothing more needs to be said. Are you a paid promoter? Hardly. Never submitted to CBCS. Only ever submitted 5 books total 7 years ago to CGC. I, personally, feel slabbing my PC books is a waste of my money. I just don't believe all that's needed to speed things up is to work faster, or hiring more graders. Working faster could mean inaccuracy. How is that supposed to help this business? Then again I guess some people would hope it means higher grades being spit out in a hurry because defects are missed. More graders means more payroll means higher prices means threads crying about higher prices.
	5 years ago	Post 29 • IP flag post

Collector 46	46 nrad private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	@MR_SigS So you just use CBCS or others for books you want to sell or are getting graded for others?...I'm guessing you want to be able to open your books, or just don't need them graded if they are in your PC for good. I agree that at this point there is no good solution except for giving it time for additional staff to get up to speed, but I just think everything was handled very poorly, from the lack of communication, lack of any gesture to make up for the added wait, and continuing to take on more books while advertising the same TAT for months etc.
	5 years ago	Post 30 • IP flag post

It was a one trick pony show but always hilarious. 68.05K	68.05K GAC private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament @GAC This was made public by me, the involved party. I made this public because there are several other paying members with submissions in excess of 20+ weeks, who have seen no status board updates or received any communication from CBCS regarding their orders; but aren't willing to poke the komodo/make waves. Steve Ricketts, Tim Bilderhauser (forgive me if I butchered that), and other production level staff have been fielding complaints/questions in the forums, and Jake Fleming has been doing his part to keep up with the deluge of customer complaints; but I think it only fair to those individuals in the 20+ week TAT group to see the formal indifference high level management has for honoring their own invoices. I know it was you who made this public but what I mean is why would you make an obvious private exchange public? I get the impression you feel like you're making a public service announcement.
	5 years ago	Post 31 • IP flag post

Johnny, where are your buccaneers? Johnny: Under my buccan hat. 4.76K	4.76K Gotlift private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 4
	Ok here comes my two cents Mrsigs. More graders means more production There’s definitely enough supply to support more help. Now this. If you went to a large grocery store and they had one checker and 100 people standing in line waiting and the store manager comes out and says we have chairs in isle 5 so you can just relax and wait. You raise your hand and ask why can’t you open a check out to move things along. He states you just need to wait or we hate to see you go but. Wow. Again. Wow. I’m in my 30th week. 2 weeks in grading then billing. Maybe 31 or32. Since then I have went across the street. Here’s the results. 6 weeks. 6 weeks. 5 weeks. And waiting for the fourth which should still come under 30 weeks. I’m not bitching just making a statement. I use CBCS for VSP and am great full for that. I’m patient but I’m not standing in line in Dallas. I really hate physically waiting. So at the grocery store I would have left before I got a cart. In this case it’s out of site out of mind. Other people here tonight have given examples pertaining to their business and their solution was to go help move the order through or handle the customers problems face to face , by phone or emails not pointing the customer to a chair and saying wait or leave. Coming out of the office and grabbing the keyboard because someone insinuated legal action is kind of like closing the door after the horse leaves and then watching the barn burn down because nobody turned the water on for you. I am getting seriously worried that by the time they finally figure how not to lose all their customers Beckett will shut them down, close the doors and go wash their hands. CGC wins we all lose. Beckett has been around for awhile and has a great customer base. You have a thorn in your foot you pull it out and don’t walk through the thorn patch again. I’m done Good night.
	5 years ago	Post 32 • IP flag post

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Quote:

Originally Posted by GAC
I know it was you who made this public but what I mean is why would you make an obvious private exchange public?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BabaLament
I made this public because there are several other paying members with submissions in excess of 20+ weeks, who have seen no status board updates or received any communication from CBCS regarding their orders; but aren't willing to poke the komodo/make waves.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GAC
I get the impression you feel like you're making a public service announcement.

This isn't public, its the CBCS forum. Public would be running off to IGN, Kotaku, CBR, etc. to complain. I don't carry tales outside the family. However, as a *paying* member, I think open & honest communication should be accepted and encouraged.

The mea culpa from Mr. Murray posted by Mr. Rickets two months ago, was well executed, if poorly timed, PR. I decided to send an e-mail, and it was ill received. How dare these paying customers respectfully request we provide the service for which we have been paid, in advance, in full, in a timely manner! The difference in tone between the mea-culpa posting and personalized response is unfortunate.

The overriding point is that *upper management does not care*. The attitude reminds me of the Bamboo Lounge scene from Goodfellas where Paulie becomes a partner.

You obviously disagree, and that's fine. Its my opinion; I could be wrong. However, try and see things from my, and anyone else with books in over 20+ weeks perspective.

5 years ago

It was a one trick pony show but always hilarious. 68.05K	68.05K GAC private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament Quote: Originally Posted by GAC I know it was you who made this public but what I mean is why would you make an obvious private exchange public? Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament I made this public because there are several other paying members with submissions in excess of 20+ weeks, who have seen no status board updates or received any communication from CBCS regarding their orders; but aren't willing to poke the komodo/make waves. Quote: Originally Posted by GAC I get the impression you feel like you're making a public service announcement. This isn't public, its the CBCS forum. Public would be running off to IGN, Kotaku, CBR, etc. to complain. I don't carry tales outside the family. However, as a paying member, I think open & honest communication should be accepted and encouraged. The mea culpa from Mr. Murray posted by Mr. Rickets two months ago, was well executed, if poorly timed, PR. I decided to send an e-mail, and it was ill received. How dare these paying customers respectfully request we provide the service for which we have been paid, in advance, in full, in a timely manner! The overriding point is that upper management does not care. The attitude reminds me of the Bamboo Lounge scene from Goodfellas where Paulie becomes a partner. You obviously disagree, and that's fine. Its my opinion; I could be wrong. However, try and see things from my, and anyone else with books in over 20+ weeks perspective. I have no issue with paying clients being upset when services are not fulfilled within the agreed upon terms. I am currently in week 20 and not particularly pleased. I guess we have a differing opinion in what is considered public.
	5 years ago	Post 34 • IP flag post

You think I'm joking, I'm not. 19.86K	19.86K earthshaker01 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 5
	I usually send comics in groups of 20 to 30 books every couple months. Kind of a constant feed of books year round. I have had over 1000 books graded by cbcs since their doors opened. I currently have over 100 books over 5 orders at CBCS. All orders show grading status, but it has shown that for a long long time. I have another 1500 or so books I plan on gradind using same submission style over next few years, or atleast I did. Since I can get no real updates and closing in on 16 weeks on some of the orders, I have decided to stop submitting books until I have all orders back in house. I will likely wait until submission times return to some level or normalcy. I love the product, but get a bad feeling having more than 100 books out there for months with no clue as to their status. Might switch back to CGC, as I have a few hundred graded by them as well.
	5 years ago	Post 35 • IP flag post

Collector 1.83K	1.83K DJC_II private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 7
	So I reread the response by Mr. Murray. My first impression was different than my reread. After rereading, I do have to say his response was very articulate, kind, but also straight forward. His legal action comments threw me for a loop originally, but now digesting it, I see what he was trying to say. I think your emails were straight forward as well, and I think it can be seen they are coming from a place of frustration. I think this was all... well... to be expected. Mimicking what others are saying, I think CBCS has an interesting, and truthfully, preferred corner in the market and industry, but the people they cater to, shouldn't be treated like second class citizens. Right now they are delivering second class service.
	5 years ago	Post 36 • IP flag post

Collector 4.03K	4.03K VaComicsGuy private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by earthshaker01 . . . I have decided to stop submitting books until I have all orders back in house. I will likely wait until submission times return to some level or normalcy. . I've been holding off too. I think a lot of people are starting to. The problem with that is when TATs return to normal, I think there are going to be a ton of books sent in and TATs are going to get screwed again.
	5 years ago	Post 37 • IP flag post

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Quote:

Originally Posted by nrad
@MR_SigS So you just use CBCS or others for books you want to sell or are getting graded for others?

I don't sell comics, actually. I buy a lot, though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nrad
...I'm guessing you want to be able to open your books, or just don't need them graded if they are in your PC for good.

Correct- I'm confident in my own grading. I do buy slabbed books, though. Some to crack, some to leave as is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nrad
I agree that at this point there is no good solution except for giving it time for additional staff to get up to speed, but I just think everything was handled very poorly, from the lack of communication, lack of any gesture to make up for the added wait, and continuing to take on more books while advertising the same TAT for months etc.

I believe my books were with CGC for 6-8 months years ago. I might have checked on them twice. I could have checked on them daily, but the result would have been the same, just filled with stress.

5 years ago

Collector 1.97K	1.97K RyanHicks private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 10
	@BabaLament, On one hand, I applaud you sticking to the principle of the matter and following through with the return/refund even though your books were near the finish line; I fully appreciate that to you, a deal was made with certain terms and when those terms weren't met, the deal was broken. On the other hand....all of the drama revolving around TAT's for the past few months really just seems over-the-top to me, and it is because of this mentality right here: Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament So hopefully my books are returned, in good condition, and promptly. They'll go in a box with the rest of the books I want to have graded, and someday they might find their way into a slab. There is a saying in the comic grading game that existed long before CBCS even existed (and thats because the other guys have had TAT's longer than this historically): "Submit it and forget it!" TAT's always go up and down with every company...but, if you are a collector, and you like the end product (which you said you did), what does it really matter in the grand scheme of things if the books are sitting in a box in your closet, or sitting in a box in CBCS' vault? (Frankly, CBCS vault is probably safer) That saying is powerful because it's really not worth stressing yourself out and stirring up drama over how long it takes to get your book back if you know they are safe and you don't NEED them back for a certain reason like re-selling. Now for re-sellers/flippers, its a totally different story; I fully agree that if that is what you (or anyone else) is doing with the slabs then you need them back quickly to capitalize on the market. But honestly, most flippers should probably be using Fast pass anyways (or use the other guys if they have faster TAT's at the moment) if they really want to capitalize, which for the most part, makes this a non-issue. I want to be very clear that me voicing my opinion on this is not to insult your position in any way; just trying to be a small, voice of reason to you, and to others that are stressing themselves out over TAT's when really, is it worth it? and does it really matter in the grand scheme of things?
	5 years ago	Post 39 • IP flag post

It was a one trick pony show but always hilarious. 68.05K	68.05K GAC private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by DJC_II Right now they are delivering second class service. I totally understand what you mean by this but for me, TATs are a small part of the service that grading companies provide. From a grading perspective, to me, CBCS still delivers World Class service..that's why I'm a customer. The only reason why I would get angry to the point of asking for my books back is if I truly believed CBCS was stealing them. Obviously this is not the case. The MAIN service in which we buy from CBCS is the best in the industry. This is why we shouldn't kick them when they're down.
	5 years ago	Post 40 • IP flag post

Collector 2.96K	2.96K BabaLament private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 5
	Thank you, and everyone else, for their well-reasoned statements. Frankly, I was irritated when I generated this thread. Having slept on it, less irritated, but no less disappointed. @RyanHicks As you pointed out, this has nothing to do with a lack of appreciation for CBCS tangible product; which I also consider to be the best in the grading business. This is/was a matter of principle. I am no longer on active duty, but I still consider the Navy core values of Honor, Courage, and Commitment worthy of doing my best to live up to. Executive management has different values, which is their prerogative; those values just happen to be incompatible with mine in this instance.
	5 years ago	Post 41 • IP flag post

Collector 490	490 DarthKribs private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	@BabaLament thank you for sharing the email correspondence with the executive management of CBCS. I have used CBCS before and I had to wait 16 weeks for my 3 book order from C2E2. It is sad to see that management could not give you any information as to where your 20 plus week order was in line. It seems like every time CBCS looks like they are starting to put a fire out a new bigger fire takes it's place.
	5 years ago	Post 42 • IP flag post

Collector 2.96K	2.96K BabaLament private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 3
	@DarthKribs Agreed. However, to continue the analogy, instead of reaching for a fire extinguisher they reach for marshmallows & graham crackers.
	5 years ago	Post 43 • IP flag post

Collector 652	652 Marximus private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	From a business owner's perspective, these are great problems to have. Despite all the griping about TATs and customer service, CBCS still has more work than they can handle. And the orders keep coming in! What does that tell you?
	5 years ago	Post 44 • IP flag post

Collector 1.83K	1.83K DJC_II private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 4
	Quote: Originally Posted by GAC Quote: Originally Posted by DJC_II Right now they are delivering second class service. I totally understand what you mean by this but for me, TATs are a small part of the service that grading companies provide. From a grading perspective, to me, CBCS still delivers World Class service..that's why I'm a customer. The only reason why I would get angry to the point of asking for my books back is if I truly believed CBCS was stealing them. Obviously this is not the case. The MAIN service in which we buy from CBCS is the best in the industry. This is why we shouldn't kick them when they're down. Hm... Well, I don't know if I agree with TATs being a small part of the service. I would argue it's half of their service. The other half is delivering. I'm not sure how to formulate the argument where a 6 month turn around time is unreasonable, without it coming across as a personal opinion. We can assume that all collectors vary, from 1 submitted book to maybe a 100. Consistency in their delivery needs to be important. So, whether a customer submits 1 book or 100, the turnaround time should be identical (with minor fluctuations due to peaks). The opinion part comes into play, where, as a collector and avid enthusiast, I want my books in my hands. I do agree we shouldn't kick them when they are down, but I don't believe anyone is intentionally attacking CBCS to do so. What I feel is happening is a clear, direct response to frustrated customers. Here comes my little 'dig', if you will. If I can completely design a 20,000 square foot office from scratch, including custom millwork, complete a construction drawing set, submit for permit, coordinate and manage a construction team, order and have furniture completely delivered, and have the office completed in 6 months... A company should be able to look at a comic book, put it in a plastic sleeve, and mail it back to me. The only way that doesn't happen, is because CBCS is working under a skeleton crew, with zero to no support. That's what that tells me. They have no resources and are killing the staff that are working. Period.
	5 years ago	Post 45 • IP flag post

Beaten by boat oars 47.95K	47.95K Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 3
	@BabaLament the "Hurry up and wait" method only works for so long, brother.
	5 years ago	Post 46 • IP flag post

Collector 741	741 KYoung_1974 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 3
	Quote: Originally Posted by DarthKribs @BabaLament thank you for sharing the email correspondence with the executive management of CBCS. I have used CBCS before and I had to wait 16 weeks for my 3 book order from C2E2. It is sad to see that management could not give you any information as to where your 20 plus week order was in line. It seems like every time CBCS looks like they are starting to put a fire out a new bigger fire takes it's place. I can even understand his reluctance to give a new completion date, however, a little digging could have resulted in a location in the queue. Knowing that the books were number 5 in line or even number 1,034 in line would have allowed @BabaLament to make a more informed decision. Instead he got a "do what you gotta do".
	5 years ago	Post 47 • IP flag post

Collector 750	750 Broker1 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	It's been said a few times already but I'll add my voice to the mix. I have been in the habit of sending in 20 to 40 books a month, at least I did until the widely discussed move. I currently have over 80 books in the CBCS vault, all of which I sent this summer before realizing the depths of their TAT issues. Instead of 3-400 books this year, they probably won't get more than the 80 they have now. It's a testament to the product that I don't simply go with CGC, especially considering the higher sales prices I would likely get on the books I end up putting on feebay. Here's hoping the rediculous TAT issues are solved soon. I miss getting my boxes from FedEx.
	5 years ago	Post 48 • IP flag post

Collector 11.12K	11.12K MR_SigS private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by BabaLament @DarthKribs Agreed. However, to continue the analogy, instead of reaching for a fire extinguisher they reach for marshmallows & graham crackers. So the general thinking is that CBCS is making it a point to be slow, and all they have to do is decide to catch up. Where's the Easy Button?
	5 years ago	Post 49 • IP flag post

Collector 2.27K	2.27K Cowabunga_Kyle private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 4
	@MR_SigS That's a bit of a hyper-condensed version of the "general thinking". Hiring the necessary staff to speed things up is more likely what the majority of people on here feel would be prudent.
	5 years ago	Post 50 • IP flag post

Collector 750	750 Broker1 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 3
	Like just about any other business in the world would do.
	5 years ago	Post 51 • IP flag post

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Masochism
@MR_SigS That's a bit of a hyper-condensed version of the "general thinking". Hiring the necessary staff to speed things up is more likely what the majority of people on here feel would be prudent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Broker1
Like just about any other business in the world would do.

Just saying I doubt they're doing nothing ("marshmallows & graham crackers" ).

5 years ago

Collector 750	750 Broker1 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 2
	Just going by the physical evidence (or lack thereof) @MR_Sigs.
	5 years ago	Post 53 • IP flag post

Collector 741	741 KYoung_1974 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 6
	Quote: Originally Posted by MR_SigS Quote: Originally Posted by Masochism @MR_SigS That's a bit of a hyper-condensed version of the "general thinking". Hiring the necessary staff to speed things up is more likely what the majority of people on here feel would be prudent. Quote: Originally Posted by Broker1 Like just about any other business in the world would do. Just saying I doubt they're doing nothing ("marshmallows & graham crackers" ). We all know that CBCS wants to speed up TATS, we also know that they have hired more staff and hopefully they will start making a dent soon. But,in my opinion, it was the tone and attitude of the response that was "marshmallows & graham crackers".
	5 years ago	Post 54 • IP flag post

Collector 2.27K	2.27K Cowabunga_Kyle private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 3
	@KYoung_1974 100%
	5 years ago	Post 55 • IP flag post

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