Known Defects and Grading6458
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shrewbeer private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Jesse_O thanks! That sums up CBCS’s stance on this issue very well | ||
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TimBildhauser private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by CaptainCanucka) You have to keep in mind that there are a large number of dealers we talk to on a regular basis. When one of them voices an idea about how much something impacts the grade on a particular book it's not too difficult for us to discuss it in the grading room and get feedback from other dealers as well. b) It potentially could but is unlikely to ever be something that would drastically affect the grade that much. |
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 Captain Corrector
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CaptainCanuck private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @TimBildhauser Thanks! |
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 Collector
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DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Context, as always, is everything. "Samantha" scribbling her name in crayon on the cover of a book is not even remotely the same thing as the newsstand that Larson haunted writing his name on them to reserve them for him. One is scribbling by someone thoroughly unattached to comics and comics history...the other is a marker which indicates that a book came from a particular, historically important, collection, at a time when virtually no one collected any comics of any kind. There were, perhaps, 10-20 people in the entire nation who would qualify as "comic book collectors" (and they certainly wouldn't have qualified themselves as such) in 1939 or 1940. Collecting comics then would have been as ridiculous to everyone as collecting popsicle sticks or fast food receipts today. "Why are you saving that? It's just trash. Throw it out, it's taking up space." |
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 I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @DocBrown - So in reality, the first comic collectors were hoarders. There are just a lot more of us now, and collectors sounds classier. | ||
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 Collector
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AtlasLad67 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| BS. Writing is writing. If Stan Lee signed a Gold Key Dr. Solar I'd downgrade it. | ||
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 I’m Kinda Married To A Celebrity.
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00slim private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by AtlasLad67 That’s fine and you’re entitled to your opinion, it’s just that Overstreet seems to disagree. |
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Collector
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AtlasLad67 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Overstreet is obsolete and prior to Bob O comics weren't given overinflated grades. Pedigreed books aren't worth any more than regular issues. If a D is in 4.0 and your copy is a 4.0 they are worth the same. If Stan Lee signs your Captain America Comics #3 I'll grudgingly admit it can be a 7.0 and worth more than an unsigned 7.0 IF Lamont or Larson , D , Chuck Rozanski's bookkeeping #s etc are written on it then it's 4.0. Pay more if you like. Just means you'd love to buy from me but hate to sell to me | ||
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 Collector
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Drogio private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have an infinity gauntlet 1 with a printer defect that extends across the entire width of the back cover. I believe the majority of these comics have the same defect...some more visible than others. Although I have seen some without it (rare from what I could determine). Cbcs graded mine a 9.8. I also had at one time about 5-6 silver surfer 50s (silver embossed cover) all from different sources and obtained at different times over the years...all had a production crease down the back spine. Sent 2 of them on for grading...one got a 9.0, the other a 9.2. Both listed the production crease as a defect. I did finally track down a 9.8...doesn't have the production crease. It's the only one I've ever seen without it. So who hell knows how hey decide! I sure don't. |
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I’m Kinda Married To A Celebrity.
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00slim private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @AtlasLad67 Overstreet as a price guide may be obsolete. But their grading standards are at the very least respected. Did you see the pics from the grading guide on the previous page? I was surprised myself. I’m not sure I agree with it 100% myself, but it was fascinating where they stand on dates, writing & initials. |
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AtlasLad67 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| IF I bought a '9.8' with that defect I'd get a refund | ||
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Collector
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AtlasLad67 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| We can argue about it forever but writing on the cover is never going to be better than VG to any old school collectors who have been doing this for forty plus years. We'll have to agree to disagree. I have an X-Men #108 with a small name on the cover so I'm going to call it VF/NM and the 'Calvin' pedigree. Anyway yeah agree to disagree | ||
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I’m Kinda Married To A Celebrity.
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00slim private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by AtlasLad67 If it’s VF aside from the writing, it would be interesting to know what CBCS or CGC grade it. I am not looking to argue. I’m just pointing out that on the 10 point grading scale, you might be undercutting yourself. |
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Collector
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AtlasLad67 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Each of the three third party grading companies grade differently. Having a PGX 9.9 is likely a cgc or cbcs 9.4-9.6. I personally believe there are NO 9.9 or 10.0 comics. Period | ||
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I’m Kinda Married To A Celebrity.
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00slim private msg quote post Address this user | |
| True. PGX is especially lenient. CGC & CBCS both are fairly consistent & are typically only .2 to .5 apart when grading the same book. |
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Collector
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DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by AtlasLad67 I don't qualify, since I've only got 29 years in August. No one's disputing most of what you're saying. But context, as always, is everything. By the way...not that I'm by any means an expert on the Church collection, but how do you know the numbers on the cover are Chuck's, and not Edgar's...? |
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DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by AtlasLad67 If there are no 9.9 or 10.0 comics, there's no point in having those designations. There certainly are such books. They're to be found in the collections of people who meticulously selected copies at or very near the time the books were published, from a large number of brand new copies (20-50 or more), selecting the very best of those brand new copies. They are not to be found anywhere in the backstock of any dealer in any convention hall in the world, because those people 1. do not know how to handle comics, and 2. they allow their comics to be pawed through by masses of people who also don't know how to handle comics. If you find one, it is either an incredibly lucky day for you, and you might consider playing the lottery, or it's already slabbed by a reputable third party grader. |
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AtlasLad67 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I've read several articles over 30 odd years. Regardless Edgar nor Chuck were publishers , editors , writers , etc so their writing on a cover is as much a defect as yours or mine | ||
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DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I agree with you in principle. But, as I said before, context is critical. In the case of Church's books, if he was the one who wrote his codes on his books, then, in that context, it becomes historically significant, and, while it is absolutely a defect, and not "as made", the historical significance of that writing far outweighs the negatives of writing on the cover. Now, if CHUCK was the one who wrote them...and I've never heard anything along those lines, not even from Chuck, but I'm not entirely discounting it...then that significant is substantially less, but not of the level of a child's scribble, for example. Same as the "Court Copies" of the various early Action Comics. Is the book defaced? Absolutely. But, in that context, it represents a historically significant event, and so those stamps and writing ADD to that copy's significance, rather than just nondescript scribbling by random persons.  All that to say...I don't think that any writing on a cover automatically caps the book at 4.0, regardless of any other factor. It would have to be pretty ugly and substantial for an "otherwise 9.0 copy" to be brought down to 4.0. |
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