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CBCS Signature VSPGrading Help Needed

Worth getting signature verified/graded?5749

Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
First post. I got the following comics for under $35:

Marvel Milestone Edition: Fantastic Four #1 (SS Stan Lee)
Spawn #1 - Black & White Edition (SS Todd McFarlane)

Spine damage only. The Spawn has been pressed and plan to press the FF next week.

What I would like to know, if sending these in to get a VSP red label is a good investment or I should send them to a cheaper grading company which would save $20 each? I don't plan to sell them for a while, but when I retire in 25 years, we will downsize and sell. If these where NM+, I would send to CBCS without question, but the damage is making me wonder.

Let me know your thoughts of what grades they could get and if I should grade with CBCS, which is more expensive, but could get the value back in years, or go with the cheaper option. Please refer to the attached pics.
Thanks!









Post 1 IP   flag post
Collector BrianGreensnips private msg quote post Address this user
I would say the books will probably fall below the 9.0 mark. I would recommend putting them in a nice top loader or Mylite Myler bag. But they are your books and you need to do what makes you happy.
Post 2 IP   flag post
Collector ZosoRocks private msg quote post Address this user
IMO - here are some helpful quick visual tips to slab of not to slab....

Again...just IMO....questions to ask...

- how many visual defects are notice right away. Over 5, consider it to be lower than 9.0, even if pressing, unless pressing removes defects.
- how man defects cannot be removed. This solidifies the grade to be lower than 9.0
- is it a key issue
- does grading affect the investment value
- if is it a modern key - is it rare and worthy of and on average, a $41.00 initial cost? If not, it us not worthy to slab
- can a Raw grade be applied? This allows the book to be "graded", and allows a fair baseline for selling....but is not as constricted as slabbing.

Just my two cents.

Good luck.
Post 3 IP   flag post
Collector ZosoRocks private msg quote post Address this user
Color breaking defects hurt the grade. For me....unless it is quite special....color breaking defects cause me NOT to slab that book.

But that is me....slab what you like....
Post 4 IP   flag post
Collector CopperAgeKids private msg quote post Address this user
Actually, I am pretty sure that the price drops significantly when you are subbing 2 or more books for verified labels.

CGC will ignore the signatures (they will not count against the grade) and grade then in green Qualified labels.

The Spawn looks like an 8.0/8.5.

The FF 1 I didn't look at closely but considering it is a Lee sig on an FF 1 90's reprint....assuming the main issue is the top RC bend).....well these books are tough in 9.6/9.8 be the spines get CB spine ticks easily and the silver edges often have light scratchrs, light wear and fingerprints.

But even if you get hammered on the grade , a Lee sig is an automatic $100 on any key book reprint, to start with.

They should both be pressed/graded for red labels.
Post 5 IP   flag post
Collector CopperAgeKids private msg quote post Address this user
Or list them as is and offer a "CBCS VERIFIED SIGNATURE PROGRAM GUARANTEED GRADE".

Assuming you know for certain the sigs are legit.
Post 6 IP   flag post
Collector MR_SigS private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Popeye
Let me know your thoughts of what grades they could get and if I should grade with CBCS, which is more expensive, but could get the value back in years, or go with the cheaper option. Please refer to the attached pics.
Thanks!


I'm not too familiar with modern grading, they appear [to me] to be held to a higher standard, but as is I don't think either would get an impressive grade. And in 25 years I'm not so sure if either would be a hot book (or sig, for that matter).
I personally would treat these as a fond memory, assuming you yourself had these signed, or at least a 'special' possession.

I should add that I do not submit books for grading, which naturally factors into my opinion.
Post 7 IP   flag post
Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks for the feedback. I got a guarantee that the Stan sig is legit and if it grades as not, I can send it back to the seller and he will pick up the costs. For the Todd sig, I'm betting it is, but got in a huge bundle of other comics so going to take the risk. I agree the books will get a 8.0-9.0. Once I press the FF, I will post it here.

Based on this feedback, I will send them in for red labels, since I founds some more expensive books I want to to get verified with COAs. BTW, I don't collect any raw comics since I want my wife to flip them easily, if something happended. So push all raws I don't want to slab through eBay.

Cheers.
Post 8 IP   flag post
Snikt! Wolverine private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Actually, I am pretty sure that the price drops significantly when you are subbing 2 or more books for verified labels.

CGC will ignore the signatures (they will not count against the grade) and grade then in green Qualified labels.

The Spawn looks like an 8.0/8.5.

The FF 1 I didn't look at closely but considering it is a Lee sig on an FF 1 90's reprint....assuming the main issue is the top RC bend).....well these books are tough in 9.6/9.8 be the spines get CB spine ticks easily and the silver edges often have light scratchrs, light wear and fingerprints.

But even if you get hammered on the grade , a Lee sig is an automatic $100 on any key book reprint, to start with.

They should both be pressed/graded for red labels.


I'd be carefull with CGC. I have a Death of Wolverine #4 signed by Lee, Soule, Trimpe and Wein. CGC only witnessed 2 the other 2 were done at a dessert winds signing. Book is in amazing shape, almost perfect but only got a 8.0. I called CGC and was told in no uncertain terms that the unwitnessed sigs were the reason for the lower grade. This was a few years ago and maybe they've changed now but they have been known to gives book a lower score for that sometimes.
Post 9 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user
Looks like the Spawn book lost lots of ink during the pressing process.
Post 10 IP   flag post
Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
Wolverine - I would not sent signed books to CGC since it would get the green label. I was thinking of sending them to PGX, but know many folks are not happy with their reputation and didn't want to stir the pot. Maybe I have now?

CFP_Comics - I wish I had taken a pic beforehand, but did not notice any color loss, so you can provide some feedback regarding my pressing skills when I press the FF, since I provided a before shot and will provide an after shot when done.

Thanks!
Post 11 IP   flag post
Collector ZosoRocks private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Popeye
Wolverine - I would not sent signed books to CGC since it would get the green label. I was thinking of sending them to PGX, but know many folks are not happy with their reputation and didn't want to stir the pot. Maybe I have now?

CFP_Comics - I wish I had taken a pic beforehand, but did not notice any color loss, so you can provide some feedback regarding my pressing skills when I press the FF, since I provided a before shot and will provide an after shot when done.

Thanks!


This can be a double edged sword - IMO.

For example.

I have a SW1 signed by Chaykin - CGC 9.6 Green label.

Granted, I will eventually change it to CBCS red label.....but for a true collector, knowing what Chaykin's signature looks like, if I were to sell it off today....the responses I would get are these:

- a green label? Hmmm.....not authentic
- the sig looks valid.....CGC 9.6 with signature....easy $200.00
- CGC green label with "mark on cover" - hmmmm - does it detract from the coolness? Nope? Who's siignature is it? a 9.6 CGC SW1....easily $150.00.

A double edged sword.

IMO - it is easily worth $250.00 and I probably wouldn't ask for anything less - knowing that it can be VSPed Red label and put it around $400. Here are a couple 9.6 ebay sold listings.

Look at this on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/282822932779

Look at this on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/202205376583

Just my opinion of Green versus Red - and I live in New Mexico.

LOL

Cheers!
Post 12 IP   flag post
Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
Okay. Got the FF pressed. Think it helped. Now need to find the funds to get these graded with some others, which I'm looking at submitting as well. Probably five in total. It will be a while for me to update this post with the results, but will provide updated pics of the graded comics once I get them back. Thanks for your feedback!



Post 13 IP   flag post
Collector ComicHaulics private msg quote post Address this user
Wow the press looks like it worked well
Post 14 IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
@Popeye welcome to the forum.

Regarding the FF reprint I don’t think it is worth it. It’s not really an investment just a nice thing to have. In my opinion value will not go up much.

Regarding the Spawn the signature looks fake to me. Might be disappointed when you send it in and it fails. The “cheaper” grading company will probably verify it, they verify anything lol.
Post 15 IP   flag post
Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
@ComicHaulics - Thanks. I know the folks who press as a career will probably point out areas of improvement, but its worked well for me over the years and pressed close to 300 books now and the press has paid for itself over and over again. I know pressing is a controversial subject, but if its not restoration, and it improves the look and presentation of the comic, so why not?

@KingNampa - Now I'm on the fence. My plan is put these on my wall in my office around some signed posters. Like I said, got both for under $35 so not a big investment here. Hmmm.. maybe only submit the comics to CBCS that I have COAs for. Thanks the input.
Post 16 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user
Here is an authentic Todd signature for comparison sake.


Post 17 IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
@Popeye Here I pasted it together so you can compare. Left is the real one posted by @CFP_Comics

In my opinion the "T", "F", "AR" Extra Long "L". All look suspect. Also, what is that line under the "L" ?



Post 18 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR kaptainmyke private msg quote post Address this user
To me, the McFarlane signature is NOT real. I've got quite a few McFarlane sigs. Look closely for starters at the final "E". The middle cross line is always straight horizontal or curves upwards, never downwards. His "a" in McFarlane is also always lowercase. It's weird looking and "off" to me.


I personally would not press , grade or bother with a milestone edition. The Stan sig appears real.
Post 19 IP   flag post
Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
@KingNampa - Todd has signed his name in so many different ways over the years. Here's an example with that line under the L.


Post 20 IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
@Popeye Totally understand. There are variations. I'm no expert but I agree with @kaptainmyke the "E" looks weird too. Could be he was drunk when he signed your book.
Post 21 IP   flag post
Collector Popeye private msg quote post Address this user
@KingNampa - I did get the book overseas. So who knows. I'll send it to the the cheap graders and report back in a few months. Cheers.
Post 22 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR kaptainmyke private msg quote post Address this user







Post 23 IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
@kaptainmyke where is the poster Mike? GTFO
Post 24 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR kaptainmyke private msg quote post Address this user
shut up! i didn't know i took the poster out as a kid
Post 25 IP   flag post
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