Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
My point simply was, the right hate FDR for exactly what the Left love him for. He did bad things. He did good things. Neither side seems to ever want to admit both.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
My point simply was, the right hate FDR for exactly what the Left love him for. He did bad things. He did good things. Neither side seems to ever want to admit both.
Here are just my quotes from this very thread, posts made very recently. You tell me if "neither side seems to ever want to admit both" is a fair charge, as far as my comments have been concerned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
He was another person who was "the smartest guy in the room." That was TRUE...
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
As a war president, he was fantastic
If you are going to participate in these discussions, you need to show THE ENTIRE FORUM the respect and courtesy of paying very close attention to what people say and not make statements like the above, which clearly demonstrate that you weren't.
I don't classify myself as part of "the right", but I don't "hate" FDR. That's the type of inflammatory rhetoric that makes these discussions so volatile. It's an emotional reaction, and leads to charges of emotional reactions. Just because you disagree with someone, and think their policies were bad, doesn't mean you "hate" them. Not everything needs to be reduced to an emotional response.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SB
SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.
Socialism is not the answer. Absolute freedom is not the answer either. Trump was the first candidate I've seen who walked the midddle; its too bad he's got mental problems, he could have done great things.
No one, at any time, has said anything about "Absolute freedom" being the answer.
That is an example of a "straw man argument": inventing something that someone else said, then arguing against it as if that other person said it.
If you don't understand, or are unclear about, the position of someone, it's far superior to ask questions, rather than "assign" them a position based on your own opinions.
"Absolute freedom" is anarchy, and anarchy doesn't exist except for very short periods of time (think days, at most, if not hours), whereby the stronger flex their power and restore their own control over things.
INDIVIDUALISM...which respects the rights of the INDIVIDUAL over any group, minority, plurality, or majority...is the key to human success, and always has been. INDIVIDUALISM is neither Left NOR Right...it is CONSERVATISM.
Group think, or "Statism", as repeated by CAK, is what leads to human suffering, always.
As for Trump...he's not "walking the middle"; he's a moderate leftist, and always has been, regardless of what he calls himself. That is why the Left's screeching about him is so hilarious AND disturbing: he's one of them. Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...
It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 
Couple of things in response:
1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.
2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.
Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."
Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.
Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.
Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.
Measured responses, SB.
You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.
No point in going back and forth on that.
FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.
Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.
FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.
Reference:
https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46
Oh stop. You can't claim the guy was able to do wonderful and marvelous things on the one hand, and then claim he was completely powerless to do anything about atrocity on the other.
It's double-speak.
Since when has political "pressure" ever forced anyone to do ANYTHING against which they, themselves, are morally opposed...? Especially since you claim FDR was a great crusader for minority rights...?
You can't claim that, and then put UNITED STATES CITIZENS in PRISON CAMPS because they or their ancestors are of a certain race/ethnicity/nationality.
Sorry. Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
@Homer Ya I agree. Also I didn't mention this before I had a promo from ebay. Sell 10 items with NO Final Value Fees. So I sold that X-men with ZERO ebay fees. 
Theoretically, if I sold it for $4k. The ebay+paypal fees would have been $520 on a normal ebay sale, $3480 net.
KingNampa, it would have been nice of you to post up that promo, BEFORE, the fact.Not after the promo ended.
Just sayin.
Why? If it was to take advantage of it, as km said, everyone gets different promos. That's why the "this promo is worth so and so!!" threads aren't very useful: everyone's promos are different.
My apologies to King Nampa, I waa wrong. Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...
It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes
Couple of things in response:
1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.
2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.
Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."
Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.
Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.
Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.
Measured responses, SB.
You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.
No point in going back and forth on that.
FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.
Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.
FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.
Reference:
https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
He was another person who was "the smartest guy in the room." That was TRUE...
Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
As a war president, he was fantastic
If you are going to participate in these discussions, you need to show THE ENTIRE FORUM the respect and courtesy of paying very close attention to what people say and not make statements like the above, which clearly demonstrate that you weren't.
I don't classify myself as part of "the right", but I don't "hate" FDR. That's the type of inflammatory rhetoric that makes these discussions so volatile. It's an emotional reaction, and leads to charges of emotional reactions. Just because you disagree with someone, and think their policies were bad, doesn't mean you "hate" them. Not everything needs to be reduced to an emotional response.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SB
SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.
Socialism is not the answer. Absolute freedom is not the answer either. Trump was the first candidate I've seen who walked the midddle; its too bad he's got mental problems, he could have done great things.
No one, at any time, has said anything about "Absolute freedom" being the answer.
That is an example of a "straw man argument": inventing something that someone else said, then arguing against it as if that other person said it.
If you don't understand, or are unclear about, the position of someone, it's far superior to ask questions, rather than "assign" them a position based on your own opinions.
"Absolute freedom" is anarchy, and anarchy doesn't exist except for very short periods of time (think days, at most, if not hours), whereby the stronger flex their power and restore their own control over things.
INDIVIDUALISM...which respects the rights of the INDIVIDUAL over any group, minority, plurality, or majority...is the key to human success, and always has been. INDIVIDUALISM is neither Left NOR Right...it is CONSERVATISM.
Group think, or "Statism", as repeated by CAK, is what leads to human suffering, always.
As for Trump...he's not "walking the middle"; he's a moderate leftist, and always has been, regardless of what he calls himself. That is why the Left's screeching about him is so hilarious AND disturbing: he's one of them. Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...
It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes
Couple of things in response:
1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.
2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.
Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."
Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.
Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.
Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.
Measured responses, SB.
You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.
No point in going back and forth on that.
FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.
Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.
FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.
Reference:
https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46
Oh stop. You can't claim the guy was able to do wonderful and marvelous things on the one hand, and then claim he was completely powerless to do anything about atrocity on the other.
It's double-speak.
Since when has political "pressure" ever forced anyone to do ANYTHING against which they, themselves, are morally opposed...? Especially since you claim FDR was a great crusader for minority rights...?
You can't claim that, and then put UNITED STATES CITIZENS in PRISON CAMPS because they or their ancestors are of a certain race/ethnicity/nationality.
Sorry. Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
@Homer Ya I agree. Also I didn't mention this before I had a promo from ebay. Sell 10 items with NO Final Value Fees. So I sold that X-men with ZERO ebay fees.
Theoretically, if I sold it for $4k. The ebay+paypal fees would have been $520 on a normal ebay sale, $3480 net.
KingNampa, it would have been nice of you to post up that promo, BEFORE, the fact.Not after the promo ended.
Just sayin.
Why? If it was to take advantage of it, as km said, everyone gets different promos. That's why the "this promo is worth so and so!!" threads aren't very useful: everyone's promos are different.
My apologies to King Nampa, I waa wrong. Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...
It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes
Couple of things in response:
1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.
2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.
Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."
Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.
Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.
Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.
Measured responses, SB.
You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.
No point in going back and forth on that.
FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.
Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.
FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.
Reference:
https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46
Is there a reason we're quoting for quoting's sake? |
Collector
Collector