Jim Starlin refuses to work with CGC2834
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Yeah, I'm looking for the thread where humans actually use logical thought in these situations instead of emotions. The situation Starlin described there put no culpability onto CGC. It was the owner of the books who was at fault for not paying. | ||
| Post 26 • IP flag post | ||
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Logan510 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego The witness was there and saw the agreement being made and he was there when the guy left without paying. He and CGC know whose books they are. I don't know what the agreed upon amount was, but for 3-4 books I'm sure it wasn't that much. I'm not saying CGC was legally obligated to cough up the dough, but if I was working that booth I would've paid him out of my own pocket to make the guy happy. Seems better than driving the guy to make this decision. |
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| Post 27 • IP flag post | ||
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BLBcomics private msg quote post Address this user | |
| There is much more to the tale which led to Jim posting on Facebook what he has so far. | ||
| Post 28 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't think any individual should be held responsible for the actions of another. I also find the suggestion that someone who is not at fault should just pay up for the fault of another, just to avoid someone having their feelings hurt and causing a controversy disturbing. | ||
| Post 29 • IP flag post | ||
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Wolverine private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I've always paid CGC or CBCS directly for signatures that are witnessed before getting items signed. When it's just them at their booth I've paid the artist directly but for books that are getting witnessed then slabbed I've always had to pay the company first | ||
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 I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The artists that are critical or grading companies and adding fees or other obstacles are hypocrites and player haters. So let me get this straight: 1. It is OK for you to get paid for your art 2. It is OK for the publisher to pay vendors for paper, ink, publishing, etc., 3. It is OK for the publisher to sell the completed comic book for a profit 4. It is OK for the distributors and comic shops to make a profit 5. It is OK for the show promoter to pay you and make a profit selling tickets All of that is somehow OK but God forbid any of your fans who have been buying your books for decades (thereby putting a roof over your head) make any money from your books that they paid for with their own money and now have in their possession. John Byrne got fed up with the attitude and behavior of autograph seekers and stopped attending shows altogether. I get where he is coming from and respect his decision but if you are getting paid or promoting sales of your work by attending shows to sign autographs trying to micromanage who gets signatures and who doesn't or what they do with the books afterwards is narrow minded at best (and an exercise in futility). If you want to limit the number of signatures or charge a fee to give more fans a chance it is reasonable as long as the demand is there. |
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| Post 31 • IP flag post | ||
 I'm good with splotches.
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Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'm quite sure if I were a famous artist, I'd be in the same grouping as Ditko, Windsor-Smith, Byrne, and now potentially Starlin. What has happened to such a beautiful hobby in last 10 years is a crying shame. That's what happens when money and art clash | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Nuffsaid111 There have been very few times where money and art have not gone hand in hand. |
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| Post 33 • IP flag post | ||
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I'm good with splotches.
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Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @drchaos you're right! And now we have this lovely nonsense that no one wants. | ||
| Post 34 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Nuffsaid111 Every year more and more people jam into the Javits Center in NYCC paying more money each time for a just a small piece of this lovely nonsense. Demand and prices are high as comics have finally gotten their time in the spotlight. Not necessarily the best time to find bargains. |
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| Post 35 • IP flag post | ||
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VaComicsGuy private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It's hard to say who is right in this scenario. As a collector, I'm in the camp that thinks artists should appreciate us and not try to squeeze every dollar out of us. Sometimes I see things that make me actually understand where the artists are coming from. I was at Tidewater yesterday and there was a guy asking a staff member if Claremont had a limit to how much he would sign. The guy said he brought over 100 books to get signed. He didn't want to stand around waiting. He wanted to drop them off, have them signed and pick them up later. The staff member commented on that being a lot of books. The guy said he sells them on the internet and uses the money to "get books I really like." Not sure what happened with the guy and his books but if I was Claremont and that got to me, I'd figure screw him. I think its getting harder and harder for artists to figure out fans from flippers. | ||
| Post 36 • IP flag post | ||
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Lonestar private msg quote post Address this user | |
| As Starlin stated, he generally does not charge for his signature. He does the signing for charity. This was my experience at Baltimore last year, where he was accepting donations for the Hero's Initiative. The amount and if you donated was purely up to the individual. I can see where what happened to him would rub him the wrong way. I'm in the camp that I appreciate the writers and artists that gave me so much joy through the years reading their comics. I always make it a point to thank them for all their work over the years when I am getting comics signed. I have no issue with a artist/writer charging whatever they want to sign a comic, or if to charge. The market and individuals will decide if they want to pay it. It really seems to be the issue or perception that if you are getting a comic signed, witnessed and graded, you are planning to flip it. Maybe we all need to do a better job of educating the artists/writers on the fact that we are not all doing that. |
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| Post 37 • IP flag post | ||
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I'm good with splotches.
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Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Lonestar great points.... truly.For every ass that drops off 100 books to sell without even meeting the artist, there's the small guy who just wants a nice keepsake and NOT have to pay the price the 100 book Claremont guy will ultimately charge | ||
| Post 38 • IP flag post | ||
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Lonestar private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by VaComicsGuy I was also at Tidewater yesterday. I think I saw that guy with the 100 comics. He was about 5 or so people in front of me in line. There was a con official who came down the line asking people how many comics they had for signing and that you couldn't get too many. I had six and he said that was OK, but probably about the limit. I'm sure the guy with 100 didn't get them all signed. At least not while he was in line. As an aside, an maybe relavent to this overall discussion, Claremont had a sign on his table that stated he was charging $5 per signature, or $10 if it was for CGC. That might be a compromise for other artists/writers moving forward. |
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| Post 39 • IP flag post | ||
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SpiderTim private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Whatever any one here thinks the artist can decide who he is willing to work with so even if you don't like what he states it is HIS decision not anyone elses. Lets not forget that for the moment Adam Hughes is not working with CBCS either so it happens to everyone. | ||
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Logan510 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego You find it "disturbing" to try and smooth over a situation that shouldn't have happened in the first place if people just kept their word? |
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| Post 41 • IP flag post | ||
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JWKyle private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I just wander what some of these books are going to look like 20 to 30 years down the road. If they are going to have a grayish halo around them where the inks bleed? Hopefully the sharpies today are better then what they use to be and hopefully I'll still be round in 20 to 30 years to still be able to see the books. Oh and I think a creator can change whatever he wants just put up a sign so I know what to expect. If there is no sign then I will assume the signature is free although me personally I will usually buy a book or two of what they're promoting so they still come away with some cash. |
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| Post 42 • IP flag post | ||
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OrbitCityComics private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by VaComicsGuy I look at it this way, soooo many collectors are just getting books signed so they can cash in when they go to eBay. I hear many collectors say that they spent x amount of time standing in line and spent x amount of dollars on said comic, and that their the ones keeping the industry alive by buying their product. I honestly believe that these are the people keeping the market artificially high, especially the modern-age variant market. If I was a hot in demand artist I would milk every penny I could out of it. |
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| Post 43 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Logan510 Why should person B be expected or required to pay for, or even respond to, the crimes of person A? Explain that to me. | ||
| Post 44 • IP flag post | ||
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I'm good with splotches.
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Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I love this guy. Last sentence is the elephant in the room | ||
| Post 46 • IP flag post | ||
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Towmater private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by OrbitCityComics I agree. The industry was built on the creator's backs. Guy's like Jim Starlin made a living but not much else when they started and did their best work. Frank Miller was paid so low when he started that he lived in an area of NYC that had a high crime rate. He was drawing and writing about life that he saw everyday. He was even jacked on his way back to his home one day. If they want to charge something, or charge a different price for those that they believe are making a buck off their backs I'm good with it. |
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| Post 47 • IP flag post | ||
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shrewbeer private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Nuffsaid111 It sounds like he has no idea that professional grading exists, and is talking strictly about signature verification. To that end, I can see a debate. As for the former, no, I dont see how prof grading is a scam in any way (but thats *probably not what he is referencing). |
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| Post 48 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't think CGC should violate their privacy policies. That being said, after Starlin left, they should have made an effort to locate said individual on their own and encourage them to rectify the situation. Of course, wether or not CGC attempted this is only speculation. The fault is still ultimately on the individual. I can see why Starlin was frustrated with CGC, even if misplaced frustration. I think he is greatly lacking in any knowledge of the comic grading industry/hobby and because of that his views of such (i.e. calling slabbing a "scam" ) is ignorant. And from his comments, it would seem that a great many artist (most likely the older generation) have no clue about the hobby their fans participate in, or the companies that facilitate that hobby. | ||
| Post 49 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I won't name names but I have a very good guess as to the lady at the CGC table that Jim Starlin spoke with. If my guess is correct it is no wonder things escalated as they did. | ||
| Post 50 • IP flag post | ||
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Logan510 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Who said "expected"? I said if "I" was working the CGC booth when Starlin came by I would've taken care of the situation and not made excuses to him. Sorry I disturbed you. |
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| Post 51 • IP flag post | ||
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SpiderTim private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The situation should have been rectified by CGC not by giving out the clients information but by directly telling the CGC client that the book was not eligible for a yellow label per the artist's wishes or until he paid his asking fee. Period, end of story! | ||
| Post 52 • IP flag post | ||
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I'm good with splotches.
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Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| "If everyone is thinking alike, then someone isn't thinking." - G. Patton A flipped $100 yellow starlin label or the same $3.99 comic + a free starlin signature? - I think I know which Patton would purchase. |
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| Post 53 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Official video response from CGC: |
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| Post 54 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @drchaos lol, I think that actually was the CGC response to the #CreepEngine fiasco. | ||
| Post 55 • IP flag post | ||
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