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What do you think of the new CGC holder?234

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Ima gonna steal this and look for some occasion to use it! 6.26K	6.26K IronMan private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by D84 So, CGC can detect pressing and just ignored it in the past? AFAIK, CGC's position for the past 16 years has been that since they can't detect pressing 100%, they would only mention it if it was a really bad press job (like waffle books). I've only ever seen it on the label in tandem with a aqueous cleaning on the old old labels. You have to ignore the fact that pressing was always restoration before CGC showed up, ignore the fact that pressing (CPR) is an important aspect of their revenue stream, ignore the fact that CGC duped the hobby into "accepting" pressing, and ignore the fact that they give Purple labels to other techniques that they can't detect 100%. I would love to hear more about CGC and Arseman being able to detect other people's pressings. You down with OPP? Yeah you know me. People are misreading what CGC said about the pressing. They didn't "detect" the pressing. They checked their records and found that CCS had pressed the books. They didn't say anything about any other pressing service. Just CCS. They don't have to detect CCS pressing. They can no doubt just look in their computer and see if the book came over from CCS. I find CGC's overall explanation lacking. Sounds like blame shifting, sounds like a lot of denial (problem only affected a small number of books) But this is not "proof" that they can or cannot detect pressing. They checked their records.
	8 years ago	Post 426 • IP flag post

Collector 1.09K	1.09K Stelbert_Stylton private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by IronMan Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by D84 So, CGC can detect pressing and just ignored it in the past? AFAIK, CGC's position for the past 16 years has been that since they can't detect pressing 100%, they would only mention it if it was a really bad press job (like waffle books). I've only ever seen it on the label in tandem with a aqueous cleaning on the old old labels. You have to ignore the fact that pressing was always restoration before CGC showed up, ignore the fact that pressing (CPR) is an important aspect of their revenue stream, ignore the fact that CGC duped the hobby into "accepting" pressing, and ignore the fact that they give Purple labels to other techniques that they can't detect 100%. I would love to hear more about CGC and Arseman being able to detect other people's pressings. You down with OPP? Yeah you know me. People are misreading what CGC said about the pressing. They didn't "detect" the pressing. They checked their records and found that CCS had pressed the books. They didn't say anything about any other pressing service. Just CCS. They don't have to detect CCS pressing. They can no doubt just look in their computer and see if the book came over from CCS. I find CGC's overall explanation lacking. Sounds like blame shifting, sounds like a lot of denial (problem only affected a small number of books) But this is not "proof" that they can or cannot detect pressing. They checked their records. Well, I am still confused about this: "There were also non-CCS books we saw the wave on, which was either caused by other people's pressing (which are now being fully documented by the graders in their notes)..." What does this mean Tony?
	8 years ago	Post 427 • IP flag post

If I could, I would. I swear. 54.36K	54.36K DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	"Dropped off by CFP Comics." or "Mailed in from Josh Avery Pressing." perhaps? How else would the graders know unless it was a poor press job?
	8 years ago	Post 428 • IP flag post

If I could, I would. I swear. 54.36K	54.36K DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	There were also pictures of modern books for sale on the cgc boards that were graded on site at Philly in 9.9 holders where you can see what appears to be waves in the pictures. I would imagine those weren't pressed. If they were, it would have to have been on site pressing.
	8 years ago	Post 429 • IP flag post

Collector 541	541 Mio private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by DrWatson "Dropped off by CFP Comics." or "Mailed in from Josh Avery Pressing." perhaps? How else would the graders know unless it was a poor press job? It is a bit unnerving that, shortly after Matt left CCS Paper, CGC attributed some of the waviness to the pressing process by CCS Paper. Did they ever confirm who was running things there, now? I would much rather pass things through Joey, regardless. I also recently purchased a CGC membership thinking to submit a few books through them and then sell, but now I do regret not holding off until the new holder is sorted out (or replaced, or... whatever). My keeper books still go through CBCS.
	8 years ago	Post 430 • IP flag post

Ima gonna steal this and look for some occasion to use it! 6.26K	6.26K IronMan private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by IronMan Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by D84 So, CGC can detect pressing and just ignored it in the past? AFAIK, CGC's position for the past 16 years has been that since they can't detect pressing 100%, they would only mention it if it was a really bad press job (like waffle books). I've only ever seen it on the label in tandem with a aqueous cleaning on the old old labels. You have to ignore the fact that pressing was always restoration before CGC showed up, ignore the fact that pressing (CPR) is an important aspect of their revenue stream, ignore the fact that CGC duped the hobby into "accepting" pressing, and ignore the fact that they give Purple labels to other techniques that they can't detect 100%. I would love to hear more about CGC and Arseman being able to detect other people's pressings. You down with OPP? Yeah you know me. People are misreading what CGC said about the pressing. They didn't "detect" the pressing. They checked their records and found that CCS had pressed the books. They didn't say anything about any other pressing service. Just CCS. They don't have to detect CCS pressing. They can no doubt just look in their computer and see if the book came over from CCS. I find CGC's overall explanation lacking. Sounds like blame shifting, sounds like a lot of denial (problem only affected a small number of books) But this is not "proof" that they can or cannot detect pressing. They checked their records. Well, I am still confused about this: "There were also non-CCS books we saw the wave on, which was either caused by other people's pressing (which are now being fully documented by the graders in their notes)..." What does this mean Tony? I'm sorry. I was referencing the official statement of a few days ago. Not the reported here summary of a conversation with Matt Nelson. I misspoke, because I wasn't talking about what everyone else was talking about. My bad. Thanks for the catch. Since I offer a retail service pressing comics, I'd like to expand on the conversation really taking place.... Let's assume the summation of the conversation with Matt was accurate. That's a fairly big assumption, because my response is rather focused on small details.... Matt seems to be saying that if there is even a very small - call it even tiny - bit of waviness to the book that the new holder exaggerates it. The issue of waviness is one pressing services should be watching for and striving to make sure nothing leaves showing that. But waviness isn't just from pressing. Humid environment in storage will have the same effect. AND does anyone here read moderns? Go to the comic book store and look at the new releases. An LOT - some months MOST - of the books are wavy. I'm in a comic book store once a week and I have people handing me books all the time they just purchased off the new release shelf to get slabbed. I'm continually....dismayed how NOT FLAT they are. Last week I was given a stack of the DC Universe Rebirth #1's. They all look wavy. Really, really wavy. Through the entire book. They were just out of the shipping box. I'm not sure Image knows how to print a comic that lies 100% flat. So is the new CGC slab going to exaggerate the inherent waviness of moderns? At this moment for me the question is hypothetical. In about four weeks I should be seeing moderns sent in coming back to the store.
	8 years ago	Post 431 • IP flag post

I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans. 98.82K	98.82K esaravo private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	If the book is firmly pinched between two plastic plates that exert equal pressure in all directions, shouldn't the book appear to be perfectly flat, even if is wasn't before it was slabbed? Maybe the issue is that the slabbing process is not applying equal pressure in all directions. Therefore it either amplifies the waviness, or worse, causes it to appear. The whole idea of squeezing the crap out of a fragile, stapled, paper item that may be older than me between two plates just doesn't sound like a good idea.
	8 years ago	Post 432 • IP flag post

Collector 1.29K	1.29K Oxbladder private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by IronMan Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by IronMan Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by D84 So, CGC can detect pressing and just ignored it in the past? AFAIK, CGC's position for the past 16 years has been that since they can't detect pressing 100%, they would only mention it if it was a really bad press job (like waffle books). I've only ever seen it on the label in tandem with a aqueous cleaning on the old old labels. You have to ignore the fact that pressing was always restoration before CGC showed up, ignore the fact that pressing (CPR) is an important aspect of their revenue stream, ignore the fact that CGC duped the hobby into "accepting" pressing, and ignore the fact that they give Purple labels to other techniques that they can't detect 100%. I would love to hear more about CGC and Arseman being able to detect other people's pressings. You down with OPP? Yeah you know me. People are misreading what CGC said about the pressing. They didn't "detect" the pressing. They checked their records and found that CCS had pressed the books. They didn't say anything about any other pressing service. Just CCS. They don't have to detect CCS pressing. They can no doubt just look in their computer and see if the book came over from CCS. I find CGC's overall explanation lacking. Sounds like blame shifting, sounds like a lot of denial (problem only affected a small number of books) But this is not "proof" that they can or cannot detect pressing. They checked their records. Well, I am still confused about this: "There were also non-CCS books we saw the wave on, which was either caused by other people's pressing (which are now being fully documented by the graders in their notes)..." What does this mean Tony? I'm sorry. I was referencing the official statement of a few days ago. Not the reported here summary of a conversation with Matt Nelson. I misspoke, because I wasn't talking about what everyone else was talking about. My bad. Thanks for the catch. Since I offer a retail service pressing comics, I'd like to expand on the conversation really taking place.... Let's assume the summation of the conversation with Matt was accurate. That's a fairly big assumption, because my response is rather focused on small details.... Matt seems to be saying that if there is even a very small - call it even tiny - bit of waviness to the book that the new holder exaggerates it. The issue of waviness is one pressing services should be watching for and striving to make sure nothing leaves showing that. But waviness isn't just from pressing. Humid environment in storage will have the same effect. AND does anyone here read moderns? Go to the comic book store and look at the new releases. An LOT - some months MOST - of the books are wavy. I'm in a comic book store once a week and I have people handing me books all the time they just purchased off the new release shelf to get slabbed. I'm continually....dismayed how NOT FLAT they are. Last week I was given a stack of the DC Universe Rebirth #1's. They all look wavy. Really, really wavy. Through the entire book. They were just out of the shipping box. I'm not sure Image knows how to print a comic that lies 100% flat. So is the new CGC slab going to exaggerate the inherent waviness of moderns? At this moment for me the question is hypothetical. In about four weeks I should be seeing moderns sent in coming back to the store. Most moderns are not perfectly flat out of the box. Especially by the spine. It takes about a week in a bag or board or a stack to "settle". The waviness, IMHO, is a product of the type of paper that is used. Modern books can also develop waviness with drastic temperature change. It usually settles out though (except on trades, especially Marvel and DC trades). I doubt there is any way they are going to get even and equal pressure on the book. Any area that is "loose" will develop waves. Especially books from the last 10-15 years or so.
	8 years ago	Post 433 • IP flag post

CBCS broke up with me over Facebook. 3.99K	3.99K CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 5
	Quote: Originally Posted by DrWatson Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Can anyone explain this? JoeyPost maybe? From Harshen's post today: "Our customers also made us aware of a few minor issues, including a slight wavy appearance on a small percentage of submissions. We reacted immediately to this feedback by conducting a thorough investigation of the cause, which we have identified and rectified. We learned that a majority of the wavy books had gone through CCS prior to CGC and that a recent CCS process change, when combined with the new holder, was producing the unanticipated waviness. We addressed the situation with a minor modification to the CCS process and do not anticipate that this issue will reoccur at any point in the future." http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9227705&fpart=427 What about the unpressed books that developed waves? Who can they throw under the bus with CCS in order to discount those? I don't know the processes CCS uses so I cannot say with any certainty. Looking at some of the books they looked to be overhydrated, which can get worse with time once the book is slabbed. I have a 7 book modern invoice in at CGC (for a local customer) and 4 of the 7 books were pressed. The other 3 were pretty much flawless so no need to press them. When I get them back I will update this post as to which books have waves and which ones don't. From what I have read over on the CGC thread, CCS is repressing the books again and then reholdering them. Based on how long it is now taking to go from pressed to graded it looks like they are holding the books to see if any reversion is taking place. Again, just speculation on my part as I usually hold books for a few extra days,just in case before sending them to the graders.
	8 years ago	Post 434 • IP flag post

Collector 421	421 matterus023 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by Oxbladder Quote: Originally Posted by IronMan Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by IronMan Quote: Originally Posted by Stelbert_Stylton Quote: Originally Posted by D84 So, CGC can detect pressing and just ignored it in the past? AFAIK, CGC's position for the past 16 years has been that since they can't detect pressing 100%, they would only mention it if it was a really bad press job (like waffle books). I've only ever seen it on the label in tandem with a aqueous cleaning on the old old labels. You have to ignore the fact that pressing was always restoration before CGC showed up, ignore the fact that pressing (CPR) is an important aspect of their revenue stream, ignore the fact that CGC duped the hobby into "accepting" pressing, and ignore the fact that they give Purple labels to other techniques that they can't detect 100%. I would love to hear more about CGC and Arseman being able to detect other people's pressings. You down with OPP? Yeah you know me. People are misreading what CGC said about the pressing. They didn't "detect" the pressing. They checked their records and found that CCS had pressed the books. They didn't say anything about any other pressing service. Just CCS. They don't have to detect CCS pressing. They can no doubt just look in their computer and see if the book came over from CCS. I find CGC's overall explanation lacking. Sounds like blame shifting, sounds like a lot of denial (problem only affected a small number of books) But this is not "proof" that they can or cannot detect pressing. They checked their records. Well, I am still confused about this: "There were also non-CCS books we saw the wave on, which was either caused by other people's pressing (which are now being fully documented by the graders in their notes)..." What does this mean Tony? I'm sorry. I was referencing the official statement of a few days ago. Not the reported here summary of a conversation with Matt Nelson. I misspoke, because I wasn't talking about what everyone else was talking about. My bad. Thanks for the catch. Since I offer a retail service pressing comics, I'd like to expand on the conversation really taking place.... Let's assume the summation of the conversation with Matt was accurate. That's a fairly big assumption, because my response is rather focused on small details.... Matt seems to be saying that if there is even a very small - call it even tiny - bit of waviness to the book that the new holder exaggerates it. The issue of waviness is one pressing services should be watching for and striving to make sure nothing leaves showing that. But waviness isn't just from pressing. Humid environment in storage will have the same effect. AND does anyone here read moderns? Go to the comic book store and look at the new releases. An LOT - some months MOST - of the books are wavy. I'm in a comic book store once a week and I have people handing me books all the time they just purchased off the new release shelf to get slabbed. I'm continually....dismayed how NOT FLAT they are. Last week I was given a stack of the DC Universe Rebirth #1's. They all look wavy. Really, really wavy. Through the entire book. They were just out of the shipping box. I'm not sure Image knows how to print a comic that lies 100% flat. So is the new CGC slab going to exaggerate the inherent waviness of moderns? At this moment for me the question is hypothetical. In about four weeks I should be seeing moderns sent in coming back to the store. Most moderns are not perfectly flat out of the box. Especially by the spine. It takes about a week in a bag or board or a stack to "settle". The waviness, IMHO, is a product of the type of paper that is used. Modern books can also develop waviness with drastic temperature change. It usually settles out though (except on trades, especially Marvel and DC trades). I doubt there is any way they are going to get even and equal pressure on the book. Any area that is "loose" will develop waves. Especially books from the last 10-15 years or so. What about all the GA/SA/BA comics that have come back wavy?
	8 years ago	Post 435 • IP flag post

Collector 1.29K	1.29K Oxbladder private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	What about them? I didn't say they wouldn't just that it would be more common on moderns. The differential pressure acros the book is surely the cause.
	8 years ago	Post 436 • IP flag post

Collector 421	421 matterus023 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 2
	Quote: Originally Posted by Oxbladder What about them? I didn't say they wouldn't just that it would be more common on moderns. The differential pressure acros the book is surely the cause. Sorry didn't mean for it to come across like that. It seems it from what people have said.
	8 years ago	Post 437 • IP flag post

Collector 22	22 ComicMadman private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 5
	Why the CGC Holder is doomed to fail, courtesy of Ditch..
	8 years ago	Post 438 • IP flag post

Collector 298	298 stophmaster private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by ComicMadman Why the CGC Holder is doomed to fail, courtesy of Ditch.. Brilliantly done, and well explained. Plus I think there's a new hashtag born...#creepengine
	8 years ago	Post 439 • IP flag post

-Our Odin- Rest in Peace 39.31K	39.31K Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 2
	Quote: Originally Posted by ComicMadman Why the CGC Holder is doomed to fail, courtesy of Ditch.. I don't care if those comics were slabbed, bagged and boarded or stored in mylar ... that was painful to watch!!!!!!!
	8 years ago	Post 440 • IP flag post

Collector 298	298 stophmaster private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by Jesse_O I don't care if those comics were slabbed, bagged and boarded or stored in mylar ... that was painful to watch!!!!!!! I know...brutal, right?? Damn, it's WAY worse than I thought...
	8 years ago	Post 441 • IP flag post

Collector 1	1 vane private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	The scary thing about the video is that it states after one month the book is graded & slabbed the books has the waviness effect. So if people send their books to be fix and re-slab by CGC the waviness will come back.
	8 years ago	Post 442 • IP flag post

Collector 826	826 Kinzebac private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by vane The scary thing about the video is that it states after one month the book is graded & slabbed the books has the waviness effect. So if people send their books to be fix and re-slab by CGC the waviness will come back. Remember - pressing will fix it.
	8 years ago	Post 443 • IP flag post

I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans. 98.82K	98.82K esaravo private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	That was just tragic! I will not buy any book in one of those cases. Does anyone know if CGC is using the same case for magazines? And if they are, does the same damage occur?
	8 years ago	Post 444 • IP flag post

Collector 277	277 Buzzetta private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	What do I think? It halted my submitting books. It is also causing me to avoid the new label books at auction.
	8 years ago	Post 445 • IP flag post

Collector 22	22 jaeldubyoo private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Ditch, you should include this song next time
	8 years ago	Post 446 • IP flag post

Beaten by boat oars 51.57K	51.57K Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by ComicMadman Why the CGC Holder is doomed to fail, courtesy of Ditch..
	8 years ago	Post 447 • IP flag post

CBCS broke up with me over Facebook. 3.99K	3.99K CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by Jesse_O Quote: Originally Posted by ComicMadman Why the CGC Holder is doomed to fail, courtesy of Ditch.. I don't care if those comics were slabbed, bagged and boarded or stored in mylar ... that was painful to watch!!!!!!! I agree. I have a few slabs I need to go check up on now.
	8 years ago	Post 448 • IP flag post

Collector 28	28 aggr1103 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	My post at the CGC boards mysteriously went POOF! after I responded to Ditch's video. Since I evidently cannot say it there, I'll say it here. For someone who only does a handful of graded book submissions a year, Ditch's video is damning evidence. I've never subbed to CBCS before, but after watching the video and actually holding one of the new cases in my hand at my LCS and seeing the waviness firsthand, I will be switching to CBCS at Heroescon next weekend for grading my books. I was enamored with the new CGC case and how clear and clean it looks, and I still think the CGC label is more attractive than CBCS, but I want to ensure that my books retain their value AND grade while in a graded holder. I know I can get that from CBCS at present.
	8 years ago	Post 449 • IP flag post

Collector 49	49 techtre2003 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	Quote: Originally Posted by esaravo That was just tragic! I will not buy any book in one of those cases. Does anyone know if CGC is using the same case for magazines? And if they are, does the same damage occur? They are still using the old holders for magazines.
	8 years ago	Post 450 • IP flag post

Collector 421	421 matterus023 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	Quote: Originally Posted by ComicMadman Why the CGC Holder is doomed to fail, courtesy of Ditch.. I feel sea sick
	8 years ago	Post 451 • IP flag post

Collector 421	421 matterus023 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 2
	Here is a personal favourite Class action lawsuit anyone?
	8 years ago	Post 452 • IP flag post

COLLECTOR 26.82K	26.82K dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1

	8 years ago	Post 453 • IP flag post

Collector 421	421 matterus023 private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 0
	CGC are immoral and CBCS I wish you all the luck in the world
	8 years ago	Post 454 • IP flag post

Collector 1.29K	1.29K Oxbladder private msg quote post Address this user	plus 1 plus 1 plus 1 1
	I really don't care if it is happening to a minority of books as CGC claims. This shouldn't be happening at all. I too will avoid anything slabbed in the new slab.
	8 years ago	Post 455 • IP flag post

623235 500 30

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