CBCS Announces New Service "Raw Grade!"2164
 I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by BradT In that case I think this ends up making CBCS look bad. Say the give a book a raw grade of 9.4 NM and seal it up in a mylar. Due to shaken baby syndrome the book gets damaged and is now a 9.0. Anyone seeing a 9.4 CBCS grade on a 9.0 book is unlikely to think the book got damaged afterwards, they are going to think CBCS overgraded the book. I hope they can find a way to better protect these books in the future or this could hurt their reputation. |
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| Post 26 • IP flag post | ||
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BradT private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I think most people would know that books can always get damaged though. I mean if it was a corner bend you would see it in the Mylar too. The other thing is even if you submit a slab for regrade you have no guarantee that it won't come back a lower grade. I love this idea, as for some of us that are OCD about grades in a personal collection I would love to send in some of my modern books that aren't really slab worthy and have peace of mind knowing I have the grade! Good job guys! |
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| Post 27 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @drchaos I think you are missing something. You can submit for regular slabs with a grade screen and select to have the rejects Raw Graded. Set your screen at 9.8 or 9.9. You were making the process way more complicated than necessary. | ||
| Post 28 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Maybe but if I submit a book thinking that it is not worth slabbing and it comes back with a better than expected grade, especially a 9.9 or 10.o I would want a do-over if I had the option to get it slabbed. |
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| Post 29 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by BradT If the book is subject to regrading you don't really have the grade. As soon as you get the book back from CBCS its like you drove the new car off of the lot. The verscity of the grade and the value of the book diminishes due to the potential of further damage and the fact that a resubmission would be subject to regrading. |
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| Post 30 • IP flag post | ||
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Deadpoolica private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Don't see the point in sending a comic in to be graded by a grading company & not have it slabbed but, I guess there's a market for it lol | ||
| Post 31 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @drchaos Ok, let me try to explain the situation. You have a book you think is a 9.4 you want Raw Graded, but don't want a situation where it comes back 9.8 cause then you would have just slabbed it anyway. Here is how it works. You submit the book for regular slabbing with both the 9.8 grade screen and raw grade boxes checked. If it's 9.8 or better it gets slabbed. If not it gets raw graded. That's exactly what you were trying to accomplish, you just were looking at it backwards. |
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| Post 32 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Perhaps because it is a new service I do not fully understand how it works. Let me come at this from a different direction. Let's say I have a friend or a fellow dealer who has received his raw graded book in the mail from CBCS. He shows me the book and the grade which makes me want to buy it from him and get it slabbed. I don't have the opportunity to get anything prescreened as the book has already been graded. My question remains in that I want to know why the grade should be subject to change if I get it slabbed after it has already been graded once. No one wants the uncertainty of a lower grade. Why can"t we have nice things? |
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| Post 33 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @drchaos in this scenario the grade can't stand without regrading because any number of things could have happened to the book through the mylar during its travels outside the CBCS building. Mylar can't stop dings, dents, bumps, drops, bangs, and crashes. |
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| Post 34 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Agreed but if you look at my other posts in this thread I am suggesting that not only is regrading an issue but that the durabikity of the materials used for encapsulation should also be reconsidered. Those of us buying slabs like the fact that the grade is not subject to degradation and do jot want rbay eeturns on our sold book because someone says the book is less than what is indicated on the label. |
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| Post 35 • IP flag post | ||
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MR_SigS private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It seems to me a scammer can submit a trimmed key, get it graded with this service getting say 9.6, selling it for FMV, then the buyer submits it slabbing and it comes back restored. I wouldn't feel too safe buying a valuable comic this way unless I knew the seller, and if the seller is the OO. That's how I feel at this stage, anyway. |
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| Post 36 • IP flag post | ||
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by MR_SigS The insured value limit is $250. |
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| Post 37 • IP flag post | ||
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JLS_Comics private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Pretty, cool. I'm definitely going to try out the service | ||
| Post 38 • IP flag post | ||
 I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Just my two cents Although I don't think I would use this service for comics (at the listed price, you might as well get the book slabbed), it does provide services that are lacking in the grading industry. We have been asking CBCS to grade magazines since the forums started. Maybe this is just the first step to them grading and then slabbing magazines. You have to start somewhere. In addition, they are the first company that I know of that is offering a grading service for Treasury-sized editions. Pardon my pun, but that is huge (well, pretty big anyway). Just in the last two weeks, I have had other collectors ask about Treasury editions. I have most of the first 15 Marvel Treasuries, including Superman vs. Spider-Man and other one-shots, and also have the DC Famous First Editions, the D-20's (including the scarce Rudolphs), and even an Archie Christmas Special. I might be willing to drop $10 to $15 a piece to get a better idea of their grades and values. The part that confuses me the most (besides the cost), is that I always thought that CBCS checked each comic for restoration/conservation first, prior to actual grading. Then if pre-screening was selected, the book would be either pass or fail the pre-screen. So if I selected the pre-screen option and also checked off raw grade, wouldn't that comic have already been checked for restoration? I also feel that if you do select the raw grade as a "back-up" plan to pre-screening, the cost should be significantly lower than $10/15, since most of the work has already been done (and at typically no cost or up to $4 per book). If this "back-up" raw grading option was around $6/book, I think it could work and I would be more inclined to use it. I also want to see how the shipping costs will be handled, since it is obviously less expensive to ship bagged and boarded books than slabs. This could get real complicated with mixed orders. I am glad that CBCS is trying new things, even if it is something that I might not use. I am also glad that they monitor these forums, and sometimes respond to our questions and opinions. For now, I'm going to see how this new product line shakes out. |
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| Post 39 • IP flag post | ||
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slym2none private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by MR_SigS FWIW, a $250 book (the limit for this process) is valuable, to me. I surely wouldn't want to drop even $100 on a book like this only to find out it was restored or trimmed or the like. Now my $100 book is worth $10 (maybe, worst case scenario anyways). |
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| Post 40 • IP flag post | ||
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mora1618 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| For me is an unnecessry services, thats only call for schemers to try to move shady books. Very wrong call. | ||
| Post 41 • IP flag post | ||
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Clarkkentdds private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I love this idea, and I have actually always wondered why the grading companies hadn't tried this. There is definitely a market for this. Personally I have about 100 very high grade but low value books from the early to mid 80s. They aren't worth pressing, prescreening, and slabbing (especially if they come back less than 9.8). I also don't want to deal with the space issue of storing 100 slabs and like the sleek old fashioned look of a mylar. |
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| Post 42 • IP flag post | ||
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dpiercy private msg quote post Address this user | |
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| Post 43 • IP flag post | ||
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conditionfreak private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by dpiercy I agree 100% with this post I quoted. |
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| Post 44 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by dpiercy Post of the year. |
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| Post 45 • IP flag post | ||
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dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by drchaos I'm not entirely sure what the point you're trying to make is. Yes, people buy slabs for the reasons you gave and yes this services sacrifices a lot of those things but does so because it is not a slab, the grading fees are cheaper (not by enough, IMO, but that's a different discussion), turn around time is faster, and hopefully because you're get the book cheaper than if you're buying the same book at the same grade in a traditional slab. If you want a book and want to avoid the disappointment of it coming back lower than the seller's stated grade, be it the seller's own V/VF/NM grade or CBCS' RAW 9.2, then buying a raw copy is probably not for you and you should shop for a slabbed copy at the grade you want instead of taking the risk with a raw copy, regardless of whether CBCS graded it or the seller did. |
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| Post 46 • IP flag post | ||
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D84 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Honestly, I just don't see the point to this service. If it's not valuable enough to slab, why waste money on third party grading? Also, even though slabbed books can get damaged through shaken comic syndrome, a mylar sleeve/board is not sufficient protect to ensure it stays in that grade. Especially for very high grade. |
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| Post 47 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by dielinfinite You are completely missing what I am trying to point out. 1. The difference in cost between a more rigid plastic sealed container and a sealed mylar would be fairly low. Even if it meant charging an extra dollar per book to cover the cost the customer (and probable reseller) would get a much improved service (which might justify the amount of the fees). The main benefit of any third party grading service is that the buyer and the seller can agree on and trust the grade. This gives the buyer the confidence that the are getting what they are paying for. Due to the increased confidence of the buyer the seller can charge a premium (which is their motivation to pay for third party grading in the first place). 2. With the raw service (much like the existing grading service) CBCS is being paid to evaluate the book and to assign a grade to it. CBCS is also putting their reputation on the line by assuring customers that the grade is accurate. Putting the graded book in a flimsy (but sealed)mylar container only does so much to protect it from damage leaving the book to take some dings here or there and end up with a lower grade than it started with. Having a book with a lower grade than the sticker (with CBCS's name on it) makes CBCS look bad. If their reputation takes a hit so does the price of all of their graded books (not just the raw graded books). 3. Assuming the process has been changed so that the raw graded books are better protected, upgrading the raw graded book to a fully graded book should not involve starting the grading process over from scratch. CBCS has already graded the book aside from the restoration check. To upgrade a sealed raw book from a customer the restoration check is the only step they really need to take before encapsulation (much like re-holdering an existing slab). A raw graded book passing a restoration check should not receive a different grade than it started with unless its case (no longer using mylar in this example) has been compromised. While checking for restoration is one of the more time consuming tasks involved in grading upgrading a book that has already been graded takes less work and CBCS could potentially charge less to upgrade a book than it charges to slab a book from scratch. I get where CBCS is coming from and why they have rolled out this new service using the existing prices and rules. With that being said this is something that is new and untested. There may be room for improvement and these are my recommendations to make this new service work better. Many people are complaining that the price of the new raw grading service is too high but the minor alterations I have suggested would bring more value to the customer and would make it easier for CBCS to justify their prices (especially if they end up lower than they are now). |
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| Post 48 • IP flag post | ||
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by dielinfinite I buy raw books all the time. Part of my point is that I can buy a raw book from anyone but if I am going to pay extra for a CBCS raw graded book I am going to want a grade I can rely on. If the grade is subject to change because I have no idea how the mylar was handled after grading I may as well save a few bucks and by a raw book that is not graded by CBCS. As a potential seller if I am unable to charge a premium for CBCS raw graded books (for the same reason) then why would I want to pay CBCS for the service? |
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| Post 49 • IP flag post | ||
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Jeremy_K private msg quote post Address this user | |
| you don't want to blow cash on sigs if a book is under a certian grade and you don't wanna have to bust a graded copy out of a slab | ||
| Post 50 • IP flag post | ||
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BigRig private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Just going to throw this out there. I have seen the good sticker but it's suppose to be tamper-evident. So what does it look like if it's been pulled off and opened? How will I know it's been tampered if I'm not sure what to even look for. @SteveRicketts ?? | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| If they actually worked a sealed top loader into this it would make the whole thing more appealing, including the price. | ||
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BigRig private msg quote post Address this user | |
Also if I buy a said comic on eBay and the two samll round stickers on the back look great for instance. How will I know it's the CBCS official sticker that is tamper-evident and not a fake that may not be tamper-evident. Because the only way to really know would be to open it. Then the grade I just "paid" for is void IMO. Not trying to bash the service just wondering I guess..  |
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| Post 53 • IP flag post | ||
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dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I wonder if instead they knocked like $4 or $5 off the standard fees (with limitations on the fmv and/or age of the book) to grade and slab the book with a "No Restoration Check" notation on the label. Then the service, despite being a little bit more expensive than the current raw pricing, could still be a cheaper alternative, it would maintain the integrity of the grade better, it can support authentic and verified signatures, can be re-holdered and maintain the grade. If someone wants the restoration check, they can pay a ~$15 "Restoration Check and Reholder" fee. The book can be checked for restoration while maintaining it's grade but have "No restoration check" removed from the label. That "Restoration and Reholder" fee could also be a standalone service where a raw book is checked for restoration and slabbed without a grade but a label indicating CBCS' assurance that the book is unreatored. |
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I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for.
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drchaos private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Thank you! That is exactly what I am getting at. |
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