CGC/JSA shenanigans21617
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Keytothecity1 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| This book is on My Comic Shop for $3800.00, with a 3% buyer premium (114) I don’t like to get in the middle of someone making money , but that it one ugly autograph. | ||
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 I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have been wrong about many things but I bet I'm right on this, it looks like someone tried to wipe it off. | ||
| Post 27 • IP flag post | ||
 I've spent years perfecting my brand of assholery.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have no idea, but I'm guessing it went like this... 1.) Books submitted to JSA for signature authentication. 2.) Books pass authentication and are then moved to CCS for pressing. Perhaps they weren't signed with a Sharpie. Perhaps they were. At any rate, signatures get screwed in the pressing process. 3.) CCS is like, "Oh, shit! Now what? 4.) The cgc is like, "Well, the signatures passed authentication and we screwed the pooch on the pressing. So, let's give the submitter 9.8s all around and hope that no one notices. Stan was shaky is his final years. If anyone asks, Stan smeared them at the signing. Yeah, that's it. Stan smeared them because who in their right mind would submit ten smeared signatures for authetication. No one will ever know. Lolz." If they were submitted smeared, then JSA is as big of a joke as the cgc at this point. |
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I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I am shocked no one at th3 cgc tried to fill it in themselves lol | ||
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 I'd like to say I still turned out alright, but that would be a lie.
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flanders private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson 5.) The submitter regrets not sending the books to CBCS. |
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I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @flanders Astute as always sir. | ||
| Post 31 • IP flag post | ||
 past performance is no guarantee of future actions.
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KatKomics private msg quote post Address this user | |
| what does the back of the book look like? My guess is sign book - slide over, sign book, slide on top of prior book (that hasn't dried yet) =smudge and probably transfer on the back of the books |
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Kinsella5 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by KatKomics That is quite possible, unsure how long it takes for Sharpie ink to dry as it does look like a black Sharpie but I could see it happening if books were signed and quickly stacked. Biggest mistake I made in the early 90's when I had some comics signed was using the metallic ink style pens that you had to push down on the tip to activate the ink. I had some books signed not realizing the time that was needed to dry and got some really bad smudged signatures on them because I stacked them. Lesson learned quickly but also stopped using those styles of pens for signatures. |
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I've spent years perfecting my brand of assholery.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by KatKomics If the books were window bagged, the ink would get on the back of the bag and not the book. Aren't all books for signings required to be window bagged? Back cover scan from MCS:  As @flanders pointed out, you can see from the back cover scan that the autograph received a 3. They must have been authenticated smeared and not smeared in the grading process. That's just wild.  |
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| Post 34 • IP flag post | ||
 Hmm... Moderated again!
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figment private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by flanders THIS EXACTLY!!! |
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 Collector
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Helric1 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson I didn't know they graded signatures. Seems about as pointless as those CVA stickers. |
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| Post 36 • IP flag post | ||
 I'm waiting.... (tapping fingers).Splotches is gettin old! |
Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Helric1 Agreed 100% And if one is as inept & dumb such as they cannot determine the quality of the signature on these, then they deserve to get ripped off with the signature grading service. It's pretty damn obvious of the quality of the signature. |
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| Post 37 • IP flag post | ||
 I AM... THE Bat-Manuel
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MurrayC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Don't know if this was already mentioned... STAN LEE WAS LEFT HANDED which means when he was signing his name, the "heel" (hypothenar) part of his hand probably dragged across the cover from left to right. He was also in his late 80's early 90's when he probably signed those. I've worked with engineers for over thirty years, and those who were left handed often smeared their signatures when signing their professional stamps |
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GothamBridge private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson not a fan? Quote: Originally Posted by DrWatson I agree. Though I feel as if smeared signatures are accepted by both CGC and CBCS, but I assume, not to the level that this is. I know for a fact, and certainly not true in this case, but if the signature was witnessed, even if it was smudged to hell, it flows right through the grading process with no problem. I have personally seen this on Ariel Diaz sig and a Leirix Lee sig, they both used those paint pens, and the books were put back into a bag and board much too soon and both signatures were smudged. Ariel's was the worse of the took as she used a metallic paint pen, but the books were witnessed and secured by the witness for CGC. The signature is also graded, so it being smudged hurts the grade at CGC and, I think but not 100%, at CBCS. |
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Kinsella5 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson That would be required if the books had been sent in for a CGC signing, that doesn't appear to be the case since those would have gotten a yellow witnessed label, these being the authenticated yellow/black label, these were probably signed at a convention etc and either stacked quickly, or as anothe person mentioned, because of Lee being left handed he could have moved his hand over them causing the signatures to be smudged on accident but if that was the case, I would have thought after the first one, if the person was standing there they would have noticed it and said something fast to prevent it from happening to the other copies. |
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I've spent years perfecting my brand of assholery.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by GothamBridge I can understand a witnessed signature, but as mentioned before, these were not witnessed. |
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I've spent years perfecting my brand of assholery.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Kinsella5 Yeah, it would be crazy to stand there and watch Stan smear 10 signatures on 10 different books in a row. |
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Kinsella5 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson Always a possibility the person provided the books to whomever was representing Stan to have them signed, perhaps an exhibitor and they went back to their booth, if it was at a show and returned later to pick them up and then found out what happened. I guess we will never know what actually caused the smudged signatures. |
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| Post 43 • IP flag post | ||
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I've spent years perfecting my brand of assholery.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
| That begs the question of how does one verify signatures that look like Rorschach ink blot tests as authentic? | ||
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Collector
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GothamBridge private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Kinsella5 I think its besides the point, I agree with @DrWatson, that signature is a bit far gone, that is a significant smudge, does it look like Stan Lee, yeah kinda, but would I put money on it?....nope. Essentially, a forger could do his forgery and then smudge it and send it in. |
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| Post 45 • IP flag post | ||
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I'm waiting.... (tapping fingers). Splotches is gettin old! |
Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'm seeing this differently from the potential forgery standpoint. If an individual has taken the time and effort to master forgery of Stan Lee's autograph, why would said individual destroy the autograph and thus take a pretty big hit financially for these books? I dunno. I can't see through the eyes of a scammer/criminal, but I wouldn't risk these books being rejected (As they should have been with the smudges). Just send it and expect them to pass with their expertise and the neat sigs. It seems like way too much work and effort to eff it all up, for what will probably amount to a financial loss. Unless of course someone wants to pay FMV for these train wrecks (which these days I don't know wtf people are collecting & placing value on anymore) |
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| Post 46 • IP flag post | ||
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SidTheSquid private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't question the legitimacy of the signatures- they look fine to me. The issue to me, is that I assume this is a known/high volume submitter that got these verified. If Joe Schmo average CGC customer just submitted ONE of these- it would not have passed. CGC has a long, unethical history of doing favors for their "friends"- a word that I'm constantly appalled to see them throw around all the time on their social media. An impartial 3rd party grading company should not have "friends". | ||
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I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have only done one jsa/cgc signature submission which is now safely in the cbcs holder. | ||
| Post 48 • IP flag post | ||
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I AM... THE Bat-Manuel
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MurrayC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I would like to reiterate what I said earlier... Quote: Originally Posted by MurrayC |
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| Post 49 • IP flag post | ||
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I'm waiting.... (tapping fingers). Splotches is gettin old! |
Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Have a question incidentally that somewhat fits in this thread. I am considering going to Hartford 90s Con to get the remaining actors/actresses from Beverly Hills 90210 on a comic. I asked the question of the promoters "will you have any authorized facilitators for CGC?" (I already know no one from CBCS will be there). The response I got was a coy "JSA will be there". As if I'm supposed to know wtf that means in relation to CGC. Wiseass Idiots. Answer the effin question Anyway - does JSA accept submissions for witnessed signatures or are they only in the autograph verification and certificate business? I know they're somehow affiliated with CGC but frankly I don't get this whole game between all these companies that is played. So can I get witnessed signatures and submit to JSA on behalf of CGC? |
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