Uh-Oh CGC, your turn in the barrel again18411
 The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| From my understanding, it was CCS that did the pressing. If that's the case, it's pretty much the same as if cgc was at fault. They're both under the same corporate umbrella. | ||
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 Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Bronte True, both are bad. But I think that a book getting mixed up at the presser is more understandable and palatable than it getting swapped in the grading process. Especially since many of the submitters do not use CCS. It would be a way to minimize the PR hit by isolating it. |
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 I'll probably wake up constipated.
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Pre_Coder private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by EbayMafia That is a very good point. No doubt UF4 is high on the press/grade/slab agenda. |
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HAmistoso private msg quote post Address this user | |
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/blackstone-private-equity-ancestry-com-dna/ |
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| Post 29 • IP flag post | ||
 Why just the women? I like bears.
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Gaard private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Whatever happened (either accidental or deliberate), we'll probably never know. And we'll definitely never know the specifics. | ||
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HAmistoso private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Happy Birthday @Gaard!!! | ||
| Post 31 • IP flag post | ||
 Where's his Bat-package?
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Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Gaard Happy B-day!!!  |
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| Post 32 • IP flag post | ||
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Why just the women? I like bears.
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Gaard private msg quote post Address this user | |
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| Post 33 • IP flag post | ||
 I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
@Gaard Happy B-day!!!  |
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| Post 34 • IP flag post | ||
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I'll probably wake up constipated.
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Pre_Coder private msg quote post Address this user | |
Happy Birthday, @Gaard  |
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| Post 35 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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Rafel private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Happy Birthday @Gaard!!! | ||
| Post 36 • IP flag post | ||
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Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I always find it kind of amusing that any thread can become a happy birthday thread. Happy birthday @Gaard! | ||
| Post 37 • IP flag post | ||
 I have not set up at a con since 2029.
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PolarisNuclearSS2020 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd Wasn't mine, either. But you'll really need to take a pic of the BC's, as well not-just the FC's. Back in 2015, I subbed a solid 9.8 candidate newsstand What If #49 (SILVER SURFER POSSESSED GAUNTLET) at CGC's booth at Carbo's Big Apple Con along with a dozen or so other books. I got back a 9.0 (or 9.2, cant remember which offhand) which I dumped on ebay for around $40 shipped media mail. Shortly before I received the 9.0 or 9.2 slab, a CGC 9.8 newsstand hit ebay and got 1st to market price, been a long time and I don't have GPA at the moment but that sold price was like $300-$500. I called CGC when I got the slab and was asked if I had pictures of my book and after replying no, that was the end if it. I havent had any switch outs since than and think it's pretty rare, but after this news, coupled with the thousands of dollars of books I'll be subbing at Baltimore and the fact I havent subbed any books to CGC in a while , I am taking FC/BC pics of all of them. Really don't want to as I don't like even taking books out of their Mylite2/FB's after I've pressed them for obvious reasons but yeah, I will. Also, to cut down further on the chance of this happening, I'd suggest all submitters have their books fast tracked and don't have CCS press them. Less time they are sitting at CGC/CCS = less time a thief has to swipe out a book. Although, I'd imagine it wouldn't be too hard to pull this stunt on a book like UF 4, and newer CGC members are the most likely targets, IMO. Can't imagine the thief(s) are brazen enough to try this with people subbing under their CGC Dealer accounts. |
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| Post 38 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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Drogio private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by ComicHoarder I have to think the probability of a mix up depends on the popularity of the book. They likely get UF4s every day to press. And who knows the system in place and how robust it is against mixing books up. But if they are handling multiple books in the same room, it’s only a matter of time before it happens. So if you’re submitting some random book for the PC that is not popular at the time…small chance for a mix up. But sending in Hulk 181s, UF4s and the like…just take photos. |
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Where's his Bat-package?
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Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Drogio If swaps are happening by accident, this is easily the most likely scenario. In case it's someone screwing around though, I'll be scanning front/back covers of all my books. |
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Collector
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ticktocktyler private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd How can swaps actually happen? I figured a specific grader would be assigned a specific order and work on that group exclusively and then go on to the next in cue. Given how people are today and the level of scamming and deception going on, I would be terrified every time I sent in any books. We can say "These are isolated incidents" but my guess is they are going to become a lot more not isolated. And these are only the reports we are offered. How many people have said "I don't think this is the same book" but just eat it and stay quiet? |
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Where's his Bat-package?
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Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by ticktocktyler While I question that it's a huge, widespread problem, I'm not naive enough to assume that it doesn't happen or that it's super-rare and never going to happen to me. One of the scandals to hit PGX was book-swapping (as I recall), but it could happen anywhere, and I'm sure some people just don't notice when differences between the book they submitted and the book that was returned are small. Others may notice, but if they don't have photographic evidence, there's nothing they can prove. |
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 past performance is no guarantee of future actions.
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KatKomics private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd lol...I just think of modern variant junk.....who's to say they don't just receive stacks of them and a swap happens in error Even this McFarlane signing - just how many hundreds of Spidey #1s will there be!! |
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 " . "
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Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Tens of thousands of UF4s out there. I think just an error but who knows. They don’t use the same graders for these modern high volume books as SA, GA etc so I’m not too bothered. I guess another risk of “press everything” mentality. |
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Collector
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ticktocktyler private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by KatKomics Right, well my question was isn't each book or stack of books isolated per the customer? Not talking about a signing event per se but even there each book should be isolated from the others. How much more so at CBCS or CGC or PGX? Why would one grader at his desk have any access to anothers unless there was co-worker collusion going on. And to what end? |
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Where's his Bat-package?
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Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by KatKomics A signing is where I really wonder if accidental swaps might occur. Those books need to cycle through pretty quick when a creator is popular enough to get stacks & stacks to sign. CGC in particular just uses a little paper slip that's loose inside the comic bag - a bag with a big hole cut in it for the creator to sign in - to identify books. What if the identifying paper slip comes out in the rush? At least CBCS has the backing board be the identifier. That's far less likely to pop out of a bag without anyone noticing. |
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" . "
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Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user | |
| For those who think “people these days” … lol. As for widespread fraud, doubtful. Risk/reward (especially in the case outlined here) is generally poor. Also, chain of custody and tracking is likely good enough to narrow the suspect list very, very quickly. Edit: to elaborate, even from photos provided it wasn’t crystal clear if they received a lower value book back. Hard to say it would be some big “score” and an odd choice to swap (with more distinctive marks than most moderns around that grade). For example, better to swap more vs less tick marks. Rare for people to have zero photos of their raw books pre submission too. So a difficult assumption. Not saying wouldn’t or doesn’t happen. But it is a leap to go from this “evidence” to “intentional” to “widespread” as the logic doesn’t hold. |
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| Post 47 • IP flag post | ||
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Where's his Bat-package?
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Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Davethebrave This is exactly what makes it a lot less likely that it's widespread and/or involves collusion. I suspect it's accidental with the possibility of a bad apple with an ego who pulls a fast one when they see an opportunity. |
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| Post 48 • IP flag post | ||
 Have I told you about the time I dropped off 3,000 comics at SDCC?
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Scifinator private msg quote post Address this user | |
I think Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson I think @DrWatson is probably onto something. It is very plausible that either ccs or cgc damaged the submitter’s comic and replaced it. Also, many have referenced the submiter receiving back a higher grading comic because of the absence of the back cover production line. That would be true if CBCS were grading, but cgc typically does not reduce grades for production lines. So by cgc standards (however arbitrary they are) he got back a like condition comic. |
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| Post 49 • IP flag post | ||
 would be nice to have a snugger fit.
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Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Scifinator I would hope, considering the very obvious damage on the book he received, that CBCS would not grade it higher than one with a production-created line. |
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| Post 50 • IP flag post | ||
 I like bean sprouts.
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James42 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It is obviously a different book. Relative grades are a harder call. But the worrying thing is that it shouldn't be possible for books from a separate submissions to be mixed up with each other. There should be basic processes that segregate individual submissions; apparently CGC either doesn't have them or doesn't follow them. | ||
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Where's his Bat-package?
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Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by James42 That'd be my bet. They're also supposed to follow procedures that require multiple inspections at various stages, and those procedures clearly aren't being followed given the number of returns for damaged/defective capsules and erroneous labels. It stands to reason that other rules/guidelines aren't being followed. |
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Why just the women? I like bears.
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Gaard private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Scifinator I'm not too sure. Obviously, if something like this had happened, the owner would've been told. Deceit is not a word used when speaking of either of those companies. |
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| Post 53 • IP flag post | ||
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would be nice to have a snugger fit.
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Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by James42 They obviously follow them or we'd hear about a lot more of this. When CBCS lost 360+ books, that didn't mean they don't have a process or don't follow it. Sometimes things just happen. |
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| Post 54 • IP flag post | ||
 I'm waiting.... (tapping fingers).Splotches is gettin old! |
Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| All processes have a failure rate. It might be 0.0000000001% but it's still there Heck - I'm in the Healthcare industry where people's lives are on the line based on a series of processes that are established and followed to ensure no one gets hurt. But even in Healthcare there is an understanding (we call it "risk" ) that there may be failure that ends up hurting an individual; even no matter how rigid and strict the procedures and practices are adhered to. And I'm talking Healthcare!; not comics So of all the things I fault CGC and CBCS for; and my gosh there are dozens, something like this as long as it is isolated and dealt with fairly, is not one of those big concerns. |
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