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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Case in point..

Post 76 IP   flag post
Collector JustABitEvil private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rbolton
After this kind of behavior I do not think I will ever be able to trust this company with my property again, the lack of respect shown for customers valued possessions is staggering.


This is the basic issue isn't it? This happened to Steve and a couple hundred of his customers in one fell swoop because someone got desperate and stupid. I have some decent books in my collection, but take a look at the Golden Age thread and see some of that stuff and think about the level of trust that the owners put in handing over books that can almost literally be called priceless to CBCS. To think that your books might have been sent to some guy's house, left on their porch with a pile of other packages (I pretty distinctly remember him saying they were sent without tracking!) is a disturbing lack of consideration for the safety and security of their customer's property.

Look. I worked in a hospital through the whole pandemic. At one point my shift was down to myself and two other staff members. I absolutely understand how it feels to be overwhelmed, exhausted, desperate and pretty much defeated by a monster pile of awfulness that gets no smaller no matter how hard you work. That doesn't mean you get to cut corners, in my work that can kill a person, the stakes here aren't even close, they're just comics. But imagine if porch pirates made off with 20 boxes of rare comics and just tossed them because selling them wouldn't be worth the hassle, that could pretty much kill this company because of stupid carelessness. We hope, if this is SOP... I don't want to think about it.

I've been using CBCS for five years, I'm not a big time collector or person with a business at stake but I've spent a lot of money grading books so if there's not a satisfactory conclusion to Steve's situation I don't see how I (or anyone) could continue to do business with CBCS. I want to give them the benefit of the doubt, now that the problem has been identified and made very public we'd better see some next level damage control.
Post 77 IP   flag post
Where's his Bat-package? Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
We need to see some transparency because this has officially gone far too public for it to just go bye-bye. This is not a matter of ignoring it to see if it goes away. We need to see some contrition because this was a next level screw-up. Everyone screws up, but not everyone screws up this bad. We need to see some action because it has got to get fixed one way or another. Not getting any one of these three things will be a disaster. Getting all three will not equal hunky-dory, but it has a chance of being better than things are now. How much of a chance remains to be seen.
Post 78 IP   flag post
would be nice to have a snugger fit. Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronte
Personally losing the books is god awful. But shipping the books off site is what gets me. I dont see how that was a good idea no matter how you spin it. I know cgc claims 3 graders, per book. I always assumed that it was same at cbcs. If the off site shipping did occur, I don't see how the 3 grader rule applies.

Looks like someone was told to remove the story from the thread but in part of it he states it was just to enter the books into the system. "Receiving".
Still seems risky and unprofessional.
Post 79 IP   flag post
I'm good with splotches. Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user
In my crystal ball, I see a future where I can choose a company based on value they provide to me; not which one is currently screwing up less than the other.

Can ya imagine that world where the petty criteria of label type and case discussion is actually meaningful? Instead we get incompetence there and incompetence here.

I ask myself how long would either of these companies survive in an business environment that has true competition instead of only seeking to slightly out perform the other.

"Growing pains" for either company, as a response, isn't cutting it anymore.

If it weren't for the stupid amount of money being thrown around for a "professionally graded comic", that we, the hobbyists have allowed to happen, I'd surely be out of this. I have enough headaches in my life to not have to deal with these 2 consistent migraines
Post 80 IP   flag post


Collector 50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd
We need to see some transparency because this has officially gone far too public for it to just go bye-bye. This is not a matter of ignoring it to see if it goes away. We need to see some contrition because this was a next level screw-up. Everyone screws up, but not everyone screws up this bad. We need to see some action because it has got to get fixed one way or another. Not getting any one of these three things will be a disaster. Getting all three will not equal hunky-dory, but it has a chance of being better than things are now. How much of a chance remains to be seen.


They need to go into damage control quickly. Their brand wasn't as strong as CGC's and with this mess it's going to weaken their brand even more. It's going to cause even more panic with their customer base because many of them who have complained on this forum have described exactly the same thing CMC has gone through, only they never got a response back from CBCS.
Post 81 IP   flag post
Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuffsaid111
In my crystal ball, I see a future where I can choose a company based on value they provide to me; not which one is currently screwing up less than the other.

Can ya imagine that world where the petty criteria of label type and case discussion is actually meaningful? Instead we get incompetence there and incompetence here.

I ask myself how long would either of these companies survive in an business environment that has true competition instead of only seeking to slightly out perform the other.

"Growing pains" for either company, as a response, isn't cutting it anymore.

If it weren't for the stupid amount of money being thrown around for a "professionally graded comic", that we, the hobbyists have allowed to happen, I'd surely be out of this. I have enough headaches in my life to not have to deal with these 2 consistent migraines
yep..
I came to these boards around 5 yrs ago I think when I was looking to dip my toes in to getting some of my books graded.. but then I saw the amount of teething issues here and odd grading over the other side I figured I'd just wait it out a couple of years ( no rush as purely for personal collection)

Right now I think I'll get some DIY slab kits and make my own as (1) I can keep my books under my own guard (2) without a need for selling the grade is superfluous at this point in time and I don't think I'd trust the grades I got from a cgc anyway.

The only reason I can see why CGC survives is to serve peoples greed flipping.

I always thought cbcs gets business for being the team that had the most integrity to do things the right way and not cut corners etc ( even if it took time and there were still some slip ups from time to time)

but this story shatters that perception and cbcs needs to address it. Sending books to someones house (assumingly uncontrolled environment) is waaaaaay beyond a simple mistake or misjudgement.. Its outright irresponsible deception on the service being paid for.

Sigh
Post 82 IP   flag post
" . " Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
Modern / variant bubble has caused much of this. Not placing blame, or justifying poor excuses, but for true cause-effect it is core.

Modern comic arbitrage opportunity (graded vs msrp/raw) + covid / supply chain + “not quite best in class management” = the “show” we’re in today.
Post 83 IP   flag post
Please continue to ignore anything I post. southerncross private msg quote post Address this user
Did someone send me 367 books off site to enter the system so I can then send them back to the business site?


Post 84 IP   flag post
" . " Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
The enabler of the situation is the same enabler of speculative bubbles (and inflation) generally. Too much liquidity that allow(ed) people to spend $ indiscriminately.

I check the price difference between cans of tomato sauce (per unit of course). I get the feeling I am an outlier over the past few years.
Post 85 IP   flag post
Collector etapi65 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronte
Personally losing the books is god awful. But shipping the books off site is what gets me. I dont see how that was a good idea no matter how you spin it. I know cgc claims 3 graders, per book. I always assumed that it was same at cbcs. If the off site shipping did occur, I don't see how the 3 grader rule applies.

I think I saw that it was for the purpose of logging books into the system. I don't know if that extended to grading as well. Regardless, it's still an epic screw-up that should never have happened because shipping other people's valuables around the country needlessly while you're a custodian for those valuables is beyond unwise.


This is how I understood what I had read. It was for checking in purposes only. But that makes even less sense. Wouldn't you just pay some temp relocation fee to move the staff to you? Did they only do this for CMC submissions?
Post 86 IP   flag post
Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davethebrave
Modern / variant bubble has caused much of this. Not placing blame, or justifying poor excuses, but for true cause-effect it is core.

Modern comic arbitrage opportunity (graded vs msrp/raw) + covid / supply chain + “not quite best in class management” = the “show” we’re in today.
agree

Downhill started for me with the whole CGC SS self certification thing.. Anyone who thinks that isn't being abused to high heaven is living in a fantasy.

Grading has been in fast downward trajectory to keep up with the nonsensical variant flipping and now we find out books are getting mailed to WFH graders because why go to a controlled and monitored environment when none of your customers had any idea otherwise .. ( until you lose a literal bus load of comics, assumingly as they were dropped at sometimes doorstep, untracked and unsigned )

I sure hope this story is a complete fabrication
Post 87 IP   flag post
Please continue to ignore anything I post. southerncross private msg quote post Address this user



I roasted CGC now it's cbcs turn, incompetence where present must be praised
Post 88 IP   flag post
I called CGC about the giveback benefit. beastboy1980 private msg quote post Address this user
is this true.
did they send out comics to someones house to grade ?
Post 89 IP   flag post
Please continue to ignore anything I post. southerncross private msg quote post Address this user
I hope they were not sending books to someone's address so they can have it graded by one person then sent back for slabbing.


Post 90 IP   flag post
Collector etapi65 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastboy1980
is this true.
did they send out comics to someones house to grade ?


No, that is not true. They sent them to be processed and entered into the system.

This reminds me of the issue with a Fedex employee dumping boxes instead of delivering. Lots of speculation, but I would assume they were using FedEx for this shipping. FedEx is an issue. If someone at CBCS wasn't on their game double-checking the extra shipping all the time, who knows where these ended up. I'm not trying to remove blame, this is all on CBCS, I'm just trying to figure out how you misplace 7 boxes for this amount of time with no idea where they are or coming across them during the move. When you add two more layers of shipping, you are really playing with fire. This is going on with trains. And during the pandemic an entire pallet of comics for an Ed Benes kickstarter were stolen right off the tarmac before he even saw them. A decision so bad on the part of CBCS, I can't even fathom it.
Post 91 IP   flag post
Apparently, I am easily annoyed. Rbolton private msg quote post Address this user
Davethebrave, I still look for dented cans.
Post 92 IP   flag post
Collector 50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user
CMC probably isn't the only one that may have had his books sent to an employee home. How many days, weeks, or months did they allow this to go on before they realized it was causing problems? I'd imagine there are a lot of people that got impacted by this unless they stopped sending these packages to their employee's home within days of doing it.

What about those customers that called to inquire about their orders, since it didn't show any status on the dashboard, and were told their books were delivered and is safely in their vault. Were they being truthful about that? What was probably an idea that had good intentions, it really blew up in their face.
Post 93 IP   flag post
Where's his Bat-package? Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Looks like someone was told to remove the story from the thread but in part of it he states it was just to enter the books into the system. "Receiving".
Still seems risky and unprofessional.

I saw that, too. Even if it was just to enter books into the system, it was a monumentally foolish move.
Post 94 IP   flag post
Suck it up, buttercup!! KatKomics private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davethebrave
The enabler of the situation is the same enabler of speculative bubbles (and inflation) generally. Too much liquidity that allow(ed) people to spend $ indiscriminately.

I check the price difference between cans of tomato sauce (per unit of course). I get the feeling I am an outlier over the past few years.


lol....doesn't everyone check the per unit cost of alternatives? been doing it my whole life!
also shopping at 2nd hand stores like Salvation Army, Goodwill etc. you can get really great things foe pennies on the dollar!
Post 95 IP   flag post
" . " Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rbolton
Davethebrave, I still look for dented cans.


I weigh the cost of botulism and even probability-adjusted opt to avoid dented cans.

But I respect the approach.
Post 96 IP   flag post
" . " Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatKomics
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davethebrave
The enabler of the situation is the same enabler of speculative bubbles (and inflation) generally. Too much liquidity that allow(ed) people to spend $ indiscriminately.

I check the price difference between cans of tomato sauce (per unit of course). I get the feeling I am an outlier over the past few years.


lol....doesn't everyone check the per unit cost of alternatives? been doing it my whole life!
also shopping at 2nd hand stores like Salvation Army, Goodwill etc. you can get really great things foe pennies on the dollar!


You know the answer already but I’ll state the response to the rhetorical - NO.
Post 97 IP   flag post
Where's his Bat-package? Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatKomics
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davethebrave
The enabler of the situation is the same enabler of speculative bubbles (and inflation) generally. Too much liquidity that allow(ed) people to spend $ indiscriminately.

I check the price difference between cans of tomato sauce (per unit of course). I get the feeling I am an outlier over the past few years.


lol....doesn't everyone check the per unit cost of alternatives? been doing it my whole life!
also shopping at 2nd hand stores like Salvation Army, Goodwill etc. you can get really great things foe pennies on the dollar!

I love shopping at the thrift and second-hand stores. Saves me a lot of money on clothes, for sure, and plenty of other things, too. Luggage set for $50? I'll take that over new for $200!
Post 98 IP   flag post
Apparently, I am easily annoyed. Rbolton private msg quote post Address this user
Big Lots is great!
Post 99 IP   flag post
Collector ZosoRocks private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by flanders
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustABitEvil
will probably determine whether or not I'm out of the slabbing game


That's what is agitating me the most. I've seen so many slabs with grades I don't agree with from both companies over the years, including hundreds that are flat out wrong and overgraded, that a large part of me thinks 3rd party grading of all kinds, not just comics, is absolute rubbish. We'll see what happens, but I might be done with slabbing as well. And all this, after coming off a high of hating on CGC and promoting CBCS only weeks ago makes it even more disappointing...oh well.


You know something, Flanders...I agree.

Why is it so important that a 3rd party grades a book? How is that more viable than me placing a SUBJECTIVE GRADE on a book and stating it as such?

Oh wait....I don't have a company! I don't have someone to tell me your grading is accurate!?

BS!

I have been collecting and selling comics for over 30 yrs and my ebay feedback clearly states "AS DESCRIBED"...on many sales I made - keeping at a 100% rating. So - subjectivity is only valued by an individual.

BUT oh wait...I don't have a company to accurately grade comics...yeah...I keep forgetting.

Sorry....everyone should keep slabbing...lol....

*****************

I bet I could still sell a non-graded, non-slabbed AF15 for a substantial amount....in low, mid or if it is an high graded and not slabbed.

Remember...slabbing is mainly used for archiving a book to keep it in a certain condition....never to be read again....unless cracked open.

Slabbing now only reflects the cover artwork.

What happened to reading the stories?

smh
Z
Post 100 IP   flag post
would be nice to have a snugger fit. Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastboy1980
is this true.
did they send out comics to someones house to grade ?

The claim is they were just sent to be checked in. I posted the actual claim but it got removed for some reason.
In reality though, none of us know what they're doing. Apparently they were told by CBCS that books get sent to homes for checking in. Who admits to that?! And if they admit to that, what is the actual truth?
Maybe they get books at their homes, enter them, grade them, and return them for encapsulation.
At this point, why would we assume they don't?
Post 101 IP   flag post
I called CGC about the giveback benefit. beastboy1980 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZosoRocks
Quote:
Originally Posted by flanders
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustABitEvil
will probably determine whether or not I'm out of the slabbing game


That's what is agitating me the most. I've seen so many slabs with grades I don't agree with from both companies over the years, including hundreds that are flat out wrong and overgraded, that a large part of me thinks 3rd party grading of all kinds, not just comics, is absolute rubbish. We'll see what happens, but I might be done with slabbing as well. And all this, after coming off a high of hating on CGC and promoting CBCS only weeks ago makes it even more disappointing...oh well.


You know something, Flanders...I agree.

Why is it so important that a 3rd party grades a book? How is that more viable than me placing a SUBJECTIVE GRADE on a book and stating it as such?

Oh wait....I don't have a company! I don't have someone to tell me your grading is accurate!?

BS!

I have been collecting and selling comics for over 30 yrs and my ebay feedback clearly states "AS DESCRIBED"...on many sales I made - keeping at a 100% rating. So - subjectivity is only valued by an individual.

BUT oh wait...I don't have a company to accurately grade comics...yeah...I keep forgetting.

Sorry....everyone should keep slabbing...lol....

*****************

I bet I could still sell a non-graded, non-slabbed AF15 for a substantial amount....in low, mid or if it is an high graded and not slabbed.

Remember...slabbing is mainly used for archiving a book to keep it in a certain condition....never to be read again....unless cracked open.

Slabbing now only reflects the cover artwork.

What happened to reading the stories?

smh
Z


i see your point. but in cases when consumers are paying well over say $1000 or more for a comic book. And the person buying the comic might not be able to grade and see if a book is true to what they say and not get screwed over paying for a book that might be restored. The hobby needed to have a second group to appraise books.

With the advent of the internet it was needed.
and there are tons of bad comic book sellers out there ripping people off on bad grades.
Post 102 IP   flag post
I called CGC about the giveback benefit. beastboy1980 private msg quote post Address this user
to be honest .
i feel if a person walked the comic shows and others paid him to look over comics to see he was not getting ripped off he would be able to make a nice cash for the day.


its needed
Post 103 IP   flag post
Where's his Bat-package? Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastboy1980
there are tons of bad comic book sellers out there ripping people off on bad grades.

Sadly, that is correct. It'll be worse now that the hobby is popularised and there are a lot of clueless new hobbyists out there for con artists to fleece. Third-party grading really does serve a purpose.
Post 104 IP   flag post
Collector ZosoRocks private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastboy1980
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZosoRocks
Quote:
Originally Posted by flanders
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustABitEvil
will probably determine whether or not I'm out of the slabbing game


That's what is agitating me the most. I've seen so many slabs with grades I don't agree with from both companies over the years, including hundreds that are flat out wrong and overgraded, that a large part of me thinks 3rd party grading of all kinds, not just comics, is absolute rubbish. We'll see what happens, but I might be done with slabbing as well. And all this, after coming off a high of hating on CGC and promoting CBCS only weeks ago makes it even more disappointing...oh well.


You know something, Flanders...I agree.

Why is it so important that a 3rd party grades a book? How is that more viable than me placing a SUBJECTIVE GRADE on a book and stating it as such?

Oh wait....I don't have a company! I don't have someone to tell me your grading is accurate!?

BS!

I have been collecting and selling comics for over 30 yrs and my ebay feedback clearly states "AS DESCRIBED"...on many sales I made - keeping at a 100% rating. So - subjectivity is only valued by an individual.

BUT oh wait...I don't have a company to accurately grade comics...yeah...I keep forgetting.

Sorry....everyone should keep slabbing...lol....

*****************

I bet I could still sell a non-graded, non-slabbed AF15 for a substantial amount....in low, mid or if it is an high graded and not slabbed.

Remember...slabbing is mainly used for archiving a book to keep it in a certain condition....never to be read again....unless cracked open.

Slabbing now only reflects the cover artwork.

What happened to reading the stories?

smh
Z


i see your point. but in cases when consumers are paying well over say $1000 or more for a comic book. And the person buying the comic might not be able to grade and see if a book is true to what they say and not get screwed over paying for a book that might be restored. The hobby needed to have a second group to appraise books.

With the advent of the internet it was needed.
and there are tons of bad comic book sellers out there ripping people off on bad grades.


Thanks for the response BB.

I also understand where you are coming from.

Again, you seem to lean on keeping a certain book in a certain condition. Great...slab it. If that is what you want....

We all have seen....."Let the buyer beware" and it is always in play...slabbed or not....we all have seen this play out.

The key issue I see is.....whom are we to trust? Why? What proof will they provide that they are the best grading company?

Subjectivity comes into play.

Again...what makes any company more accurate than me? Oh yeah...a company name.

Got it.

Thanks again for the post....I feel the need you express, but I just can't seem to grasp it with these recent "blatant" company issues.

Wrong grades, added staples to get great grades, the internet(?), losing books.....?????

Wow...the truth is coming alive!

I think I will start a new company...Capitalism!! 😀

Be safe.
Z
Post 105 IP   flag post
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