Constantine Fans...did you know this?16387
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HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by EbayMafiaYou probably have a few SW25’s. Spread the love, I need one. I also found another book, Sandman 3 has a Constantine appearance. As far as the “cameo” in 25 the webs agreeably states this. The crew wanted to draw Sting, and they did. It turned out it was enough fun for them they wanted to make him a character. Was 25 a premeditated Constantine? It doesn’t appear to be. It was however a building block for the character. I guess it depends on how much you personally are sippin the kool-aid. Me, I’m breaking thru walls and yelling “OH YEAH”! |
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 Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by HeinzDad DC Headquarters: |
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| https://comicbook.com/dc/news/the-secret-origin-of-john-constantines-first-appearance/ From the article: Commenters offered a number of possible alternate "first appearances" for the character, including an issue of Crisis on Infinite Earths. Bissette was having none of it. "Alan hadn't even concieved of Constantine before we drew Sting in that background panel of Saga of the Swamp Thing #25," Bissette wrote. "We alerted Alan at the time, via snail-mail exchanges of letters, 'You better do something with him, because we're not going to stop drawing him.' Nobody at DC knew anything about it at the time — not even Karen Berger, our editor." A year later, Constantine would appear for his first named, speaking role, and a star wars born. |
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 Ima gonna steal this and look for some occasion to use it!
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IronMan private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by HeinzDad So a building block. They wanted to do one character, twelve months later it it might have served as an inspiration to do a different - but ultimately fan popular character. The hobby already has a name for that. It's called a prototype. NOT a cameo first appearance. They may have wanted to draw Sting, but I still think it looks like Rod Stewart  |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| A much better hidden second appearance to spend time chasing might be from my favorite, Zatanna. Everyone is certain Atom 19 is her second appearance, and the big two denote it as such, despite the fact it is not. Might be worth grabbing a few copies of her true 2nd appearance. | ||
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I've been buying Zatanna books since the 1990s and have never thought of the retcon story as her 2nd appearance. Zatanna does not appear at all in that book. | ||
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Atom #19 is Zatanna's 2nd appearance because she actually does appear in the book and also on the cover. | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Not sure why it matters when you were buying books, but I have been buying Zatanna books since the seventies so... She doesnt appear in costume or by name, but apparently according to the writers she does. ....and since they made the story canon it does not matter what anyone thinks, it technically IS her 2nd appearance. Similar to what is Cable's first appearance...was it x men 201 which was retconned into his story? You could fill a book with first appearances and 2nds that are similar and accepted on less fact. Gambit anyone? Crisis is fertile grounds for finding multiple first appearances and so forth as well, despite previous appearances by characters . |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DEThat is your opinion of course, and you are perfectly entitled, but the story was created to suggest she did appear. Nevermind she is a witch and can alter her appearance and create mental illusions, like wiping peoples memories, just for instance In any event her 2nd appearance is far more...."likely" than the fishing for Constantine's with Sting's likeness, is. |
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 Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill.
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HexView private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town Isn't that like saying Marvel Super Heroes #11 is the first appearance of Rogue? Or Origins #1 is the first appearance of Wolverine? |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Yeah, no....not even similar. The DC writers at the time chose to include and retcon her appearance into the story about the witch. They themselves wrote it into continuity, not like ..."saying super heroes 11 is the first appearance of rogue", etc. They wrote a story wherein they incorporated the previous story in Detective comics 336 as her original meeting with Batman, using an un-named character in the story to do so. Some might disagree with their having done so, or dislike that it was done, but it IS continuity that they did publish clearly establishing the facts...not like me just saying this or that was this appearance of that one. |
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town Yeah, the writers retcon Detective Comics into the story but it was done to incorporate Batman into the Search for Zatara storyline. Absolutely no one would be able to connect that witch in the story to Zatanna unless they read a copy of Justice League of America #51. The other books in the Search for Zatara series makes sense since she actually appears in those books and the storyline continues from one book to the next, but not in Detective Comics. So, yes it was retconned to be part of the storyline, but no she does not appear in the book. Cable's 1st appearance is NM #87. X-men 201 was when he was an infant. I don't think 1st appearances of infants are significant at all. No dispute about Crisis having a ton of 1st appearances and 1st modern/DC appearance of Charlton and other acquired characters. |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I agree with your entire take...right up till you said she does not appear. The writers and DC comics said she does, and they are the ones who determine continuity (or in this case, lack of) People can disagree all they like, it is part of the published history. I agree, it does not fit with the rest of the story..it is jarring and out of place for sure. Much like Vader suddenly announcing he is Luke's father.... As for Cable as Baby Nathan, again another slippery slope. What about Franklin Richards ? Infants made up an entire comic title at one point...Power Pack . There are many characters who first appear as children...Illiyana first appears in Giant size x men 1, but she goes for years before becoming Magik...what is her FIRST appearance? Giant size x men 1, is technically. Xmen 50, we are treated to a character everyone calls Polaris...but she isnt. In fact she does not become Polaris for years...what is her FIRST appearance? In this case they say x men 50..... The point being there is no consistency to it, and you can make arguments for and against many other characters and their story arcs and so forth, that are far more substantial than Sting being mistaken for Constantine. |
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Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill.
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HexView private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_townI'd say the fans have some say when it comes to who determines continuity. They vote with their mouth and their wallet. When it's apparent the writers are just trying to push crap down our throat, the fans react. Remember when Wolverine's origin involved actual wolverines? We squashed that one quick  The only man who knows how to do ret-con right is Alan Moore! |
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't consider it an appearance, but rather part of her storyline. I prefer the 1st appearance of the actual super hero/villain over the 1st appearance of their non-super powered alter-ego unless of course they're just regular characters such as Lois Lane, Alfred, etc. X-men 201 is the 1st appearance of Baby Nathan, but it's not Cable. |
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Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill.
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HexView private msg quote post Address this user | |
Have they ret-conned out Zatanna smoking weed yet?  |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by HexViewI agree with what you are saying here, but regardless what we think or do, the story was published, did happen and is part of her storyline. We can like it, hate it, refuse to buy it or disagree, but much like science, it does not require our approval to be true. As to the other question, I will steer clear of it cause the forum has policies about certain topics. |
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We should have the forum rate our packages.
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HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user | |
| R.I.P. to the coolest thread ever, Constantine’s. | ||
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 Keep your $6.87 bro... not even saving tax with that.
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Cli4dR3D0g private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by HeinzDad John Can'tstantine |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I liked Constantine right up until he stood there and did nothing while Zatanna was killed. | ||
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 The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Darkseid_of_town In the cartoon, it was because she did something to him so he ran away. I have no idea about comics..... |
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We should have the forum rate our packages.
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HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_townMany people have perished just from associating with Constantine. It’s a re occurring theme in his books. Getting involved with John or his seedy practices puts anyone at risk. |
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Article from the link https://www.zonanegativa.com/john-constantine-1985-1991-creacion-hellblazer-anos-de-punk-y-obras-maestras/ Regarding Swamp Thing #37 However, it was fate that John's first published appearance was not this, but in the aforementioned Crisis on Infinite Earths # 4 by Marv Wolfman and George Pérez , by just two weeks apart. This is a brief appearance from which few conclusions can be drawn, as confirmed by the play's writer, Wolfman himself . However, it must be mentioned as the first appearance on the American market of the most British character that exists. As for the design, the green color chosen for his clothes stands out as the only new element. For the rest, George Pérez limited himself to following the essential features described and that in a few years would base his iconography: mainly blond hair and cigarettes. To add more controversy to the matter, we have another non-canon sighting that has been defended as the true first appearance of the English sorcerer. We are talking about DC Sampler # 3, published on September 23, 1984. It was a free comic so that DC Comics readers could find out about their favorite characters. In a vignette, as had happened in The Swamp Thing Saga # 25, we see a man with the countenance of Sting , next to Swampy. Trying to close the debate, the editorial itself states that number 37 is the FIRST official appearance. |
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We should have the forum rate our packages.
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HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DENice.... great insight. To be clear to everyone, I don’t really care as a fan. I need them all regardless of what they are. |
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Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill.
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HexView private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by AE Both Mike's and The GCD say Swamp Thing came out first. Quote: Originally Posted by AE This must've been written before Garth Ennis became popular |
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I grabbed a few copies of DC Sampler #3 when they first came out. Unfortunately because I was a kid and on a very limited budget, the bag and boards that I packed them back in '84 in wound up going onto more valuable books...probably Rom #57. | ||
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We should have the forum rate our packages.
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HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DEWanna part with one fella????? Lol, I’m slightly whoreish. |
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by HexView As far as this debate goes, I have more copies of Swamp Thing #37 than the other two books, so I'm bias when I say Swamp Thing #37 is the book to get. |
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Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill.
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HexView private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DE Same crap happened with Preacher and Absolute Vertigo. Previews are not first appearances. |
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We should have the forum rate our packages.
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HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DEI have two graded copies and always looking to add to the stable.  |
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