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Buying for PC vs buying for eventual sale?15739

Collector doog private msg quote post Address this user
My son owns a comic book store, he is a dealer. He sells new books along with old, has employees, has a brick and mortar store.
My brother has always been a flipper, works out of his basement, does shows. Often finds books at shows for cheap and flips them at the same show to people he knows that want them for extremely quick and high profit.
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Collector Gaard private msg quote post Address this user
I guess your son has more scruples than your brother.
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Collector sckao private msg quote post Address this user
The main difference is subtle... The dealer is upfront about his needing to run a business which involves buying and selling. The flipper may use a personal reason like saying it's for a personal collection or a grail to engender a discount, then turn around and flip it almost instantly. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with flipping... it's the bad eggs who sour the experience for people who thought they were helping someone obtain a grail only to see it for sale later.

(There may be a reason for it being on sale. The flipper may have found a nicer copy and needed to sell this previous copy... but the bad feelings may remain if they are on the same boards. Some communication would be nice or an offer to sell it back, etc. although that's clearly optional.)
Post 53 IP   flag post
I'd like to say I still turned out alright, but that would be a lie. flanders private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
A flipper is someone who buys and sells books as a sideline. In other words, this is something done outside their regular means of making a living


I suppose I'm not a flipper then. This makes me feel a bit better about myself.
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Collector Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
To me the intent (or dealer vs flipper) doesn’t matter unless someone is deceiving another.

If I tell someone I am buying to keep (for whatever reason) then if I turn around and flip I am simply not true to my word. I (personally) would not be okay doing that. Some people are. Some people’s word loses significance over multiple dealings. For some their word means nothing - period.

But back to the original topic. Thank you everyone for sharing. I wonder if there is some selection bias in who responds (overall) because of some of the apparent stigma on the spec side of the equation. Hopefully not too much. In any case the input is useful. I do think this site could use a polling function - would be a great addition.
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Collector Jabberwookie private msg quote post Address this user
@Davethebrave

I do grab a few books for spec, but it’s hard to discern if it’s true flipping because I also read them and I’m not selling within the next 12-24 months.

But, if I see a first appearance that appeals to me, I’ll grab and see what happens.

If I grab a book and it shoots up to $200 or more, I’ll grade it and keep it handy for sale or trade.
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Collector BrianGreensnips private msg quote post Address this user
I am all over the place. I buy, I sell, I collect,I spec a little, I hoard(certain books), I have fun with it, I am addicted to it,I have a pull list at my LCS, I read them.
I would say it would be very hard for me to put % on it. I do not do it for a living, I also let my hobby fund itself.
As long as you enjoy it that is what I think matters. One thing I must say is that it helps me relax and also helps to get my mind off work in my free time.
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If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by flanders
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
A flipper is someone who buys and sells books as a sideline. In other words, this is something done outside their regular means of making a living


I suppose I'm not a flipper then. This makes me feel a bit better about myself.

You were never included in my grossly overreaching generalization that I painted with a broad brush to begin with, Ned.
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COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
What's the difference? The ebay sellers that are suddenly gouging the public for a copy of Primer 2 might be a flipper.
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Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
What's the difference? The ebay sellers that are suddenly gouging the public for a copy of Primer 2 might be a flipper.


I don't understand that. Grendel's stock just shot up in value with a big announcement. Who would still sell at the old stock price? Many homes in this country are worth $50,000-$200,000 more than they were 2 years ago. Selling at current market value vs old market value is not gouging.
Post 60 IP   flag post
Collector Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbayMafia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
What's the difference? The ebay sellers that are suddenly gouging the public for a copy of Primer 2 might be a flipper.


I don't understand that. Grendel's stock just shot up in value with a big announcement. Who would still sell at the old stock price? Many homes in this country are worth $50,000-$200,000 more than they were 2 years ago. Selling at current market value vs old market value is not gouging.


Agreed. To me (and perhaps the dictionary, Black’s or otherwise) price gouging is taking advantage of demand for necessities. Discretionary purchases - not so much. That is a buyer/seller decision. Takes two to tangle.

* Monopolies and oligopolies excluded ;-)
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COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbayMafia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
What's the difference? The ebay sellers that are suddenly gouging the public for a copy of Primer 2 might be a flipper.


I don't understand that. Grendel's stock just shot up in value with a big announcement. Who would still sell at the old stock price? Many homes in this country are worth $50,000-$200,000 more than they were 2 years ago. Selling at current market value vs old market value is not gouging.


I used the word "gouging". I didn't state anyone should still be selling at yesterdays price. Nor did I attempt to state that sellers on eBay sell at yesterdays prices. We are chatting about two distinctly different things. It might be why you didn't understand it.

I'll expand my thoughts...

A store owner/dealer is an entity that I would have made multiple purchases, multiple times quarterly from over a long period of time. When they bought a large collection I'd bet I was one of the first calls to come over the next day to get a look at it and to pull what I wanted before the public got a look. In other words, a relationship would have been forged with that entity. As I would have spent considerable amounts of money with them they wouldn't gouge me if I walked in today to purchase a Primer 2. The store I deal/dealt with would more than likely price it the way he did yesterday. In other words he'd find the fair market value and mark it down the percentage I was used to getting. When I was buying a lot of older books that was 35 to 50%. He'd be getting the profit margin he was used to, and be keeping a customer who had spent and was going to spend a lot of money with happy. They wouldn't be blinded by the short term gain vs the long term value of having me as a customer.

The scumbag flipper isn't going to do the above as I never had a relationship with him/her and would never intend to do so. Flippers just aren't my cup of tea. I always stayed clear of them when I was collecting. My views on them aren't positive and never will be.

Flippers, as I define them, are people into the quick buck and generally aren't around for years or even decades. They are short-term grifters who take advantage of people. (Yes, I pretty much view all flippers that way).
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Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
When they bought a large collection I bet I was one of the first calls to come over the next day to get a look at it and to pull what I wanted. In other words, a relationship would have been forged with that entity. As I would have spent considerable amounts of money with them they wouldn't gouge me if I walked in today to purchase a Primer 2. The store I deal/dealt with would more than likely price it the way he did yesterday. In other words he'd find the fair market value and mark it down the percentage I was used to getting. When I was buying a lot of older books that was 35 to 50%. He'd be getting the profit margin he was used to


I think it's worth discussing if that store owner really deserves to ride a higher horse than the flipper...or in the case of Primer 2 the seller more likely would be "long-term speculator" or "newly motivated seller". You say the store owner could give you a 35%-50% discount off FMV and still make the profit margin he was accustomed to. There's a flip side to that statement. How did he get that collection so cheap? Did he take advantage of some collector in a difficult situation? Or the uninformed family of a deceased collector?
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Collector Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
I worked at a comic shop for years, and I have to say that not all LCS owners are warm and fuzzy. My boss would look at the value of a collection and his goal was to pay 10 cents on the dollar for it. He would lie, cheat, and steal (ethical sense, not legal) to make that happen. It was a little demoralising to watch.
Post 64 IP   flag post
COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbayMafia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
When they bought a large collection I bet I was one of the first calls to come over the next day to get a look at it and to pull what I wanted. In other words, a relationship would have been forged with that entity. As I would have spent considerable amounts of money with them they wouldn't gouge me if I walked in today to purchase a Primer 2. The store I deal/dealt with would more than likely price it the way he did yesterday. In other words he'd find the fair market value and mark it down the percentage I was used to getting. When I was buying a lot of older books that was 35 to 50%. He'd be getting the profit margin he was used to


I think it's worth discussing if that store owner really deserves to ride a higher horse than the flipper...or in the case of Primer 2 the seller more likely would be "long-term speculator" or "newly motivated seller". You say the store owner could give you a 35%-50% discount off FMV and still make the profit margin he was accustomed to. There's a flip side to that statement. How did he get that collection so cheap? Did he take advantage of some seller in a difficult situation?


More than likely it was sitting in his store for the last 5 years. He bought it for whatever he bought it for then and it sat waiting for the day it might become hot or when a new collector needed it. Kind of like all the other books that are in the store's inventory.

You slay me with the "take advantage" line. Most of the collections the local store buys are from guys like me who want out of the market and have been long term customers. They sit down and figure out a price both can live with. I didn't go that route because I had time on my hands and liked watching the books I sold during the different auctions at different places/platforms. It became entertainment for me.
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COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd
I worked at a comic shop for years, and I have to say that not all LCS owners are warm and fuzzy. My boss would look at the value of a collection and his goal was to pay 10 cents on the dollar for it. He would lie, cheat, and steal (ethical sense, not legal) to make that happen. It was a little demoralising to watch.


How long did you work there while being demoralized?
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Collector southerncross private msg quote post Address this user
Comic book dealer can force people to sell comics to them at what ever price they offer.



Post 67 IP   flag post
Collector southerncross private msg quote post Address this user
@Towmater yep best thing to get a good relationship with a good dealer.

When that happens you can get nice books.





Picked these up for $236 including tax. 👍
Post 68 IP   flag post
Collector southerncross private msg quote post Address this user
Great dealer, who just sells back issues.

Had a lcs back in Australia, same deal just sold back issues.
Picked up nice books off him too for great prices.

Worse shops for buying back issues is the shop with the new issue diamond debt.

They will squeeze every cent out of everything and even when you buy books and spend money over a long time they will never give you a break as they need that extra cent to pay for the new issues invoice.

Not all shops are like that but everyone that I have dealt with like that is like that.

Just love the only back issue shop as they are dedicated to just moving back issues 👍
Post 69 IP   flag post
Collector Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
How long did you work there while being demoralized?

Five years. It didn't seem as bad while I was there, but I look back on it now and it was pretty sucky, and I feel for the people that got taken for a ride, not that they knew. He was only able to go after people who were very ignorant of what they had.

Quote:
Originally Posted by southerncross
Comic book dealer can force people to sell comics to them at what ever price they offer.

If folks have no knowledge and they think the dealer they're talking to can be trusted, then yeah, the dealer can name their price and talk people into it. Also helps if said dealer has the only LCS in town, which was our situation at the time.
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Collector southerncross private msg quote post Address this user
My post was in jest.

And dealers either buy the whole collection at a nice discount as it could take years to sell it off.
Or they cherry pick and give a higher percentage.

To each their own.

And there is the internet so the days of people not having any idea comics are money a few in-between
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Collector MutantMania private msg quote post Address this user
I made the mistake of selling my entire collection to a comic shop when I was about 16. I didn't really know anything about them back then so I really got hosed.

Started collecting again in my 20s and have now pretty much stopped again. The difference now is that I actually know way more about them and would never sell to a comic shop.

Local sales and ebay is where I'm selling now with over 12K in my garage waiting to go
Never been to a show (to visit or to sell) and at this point probably might not ever go to one

Once I clear the space in my garage I will fill it up again with books from my storage and keep selling away
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Collector Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by MutantMania
I made the mistake of selling my entire collection to a comic shop when I was about 16. I didn't really know anything about them back then so I really got hosed.

Started collecting again in my 20s and have now pretty much stopped again. The difference now is that I actually know way more about them and would never sell to a comic shop.

Like this guy!! Only my earlier collection went while I was in college because I had to pay tuition and buy (text) books with something.
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Collector Davethebrave private msg quote post Address this user
@Byrdibyrd when you gotta pay your own way you gotta do what you gotta do!

Sold a Condo I had purchased after working (post-college) to partially fund a couple grad degrees. Never really used one of the two degrees. Condo’s value increased about three-fold in the decade after. Not a good trade. Still graduated with several (nah, many) mega-keys worth of debt lol

Maybe why I don’t sell anything anymore.
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Collector Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davethebrave
Sold a Condo I had purchased after working (post-college) to partially fund a couple grad degrees. Never really used one of the two degrees. Condo’s value increased about three-fold in the decade after

I. Feel. You. I could pay off my mortgage with some of the books I sold for a few measly thousand Back In The Day.
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