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Collector Huntergreene2 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by figment
Books submitted at Consumer tier received at CBCS on July 29 moved to Processing on October 1. I have seven other orders outstanding received at CBCS between August 11 and September 20 that still show as Submitted. My main grumble is that my previous order, picked up in January, still shows as Ready for Pickup with the comics not listed in Recently Graded or in My Comics. Me thinks updating the web site status must still be a manual operation, not one incorporated into the line flow.


This is normal, especially for Canadians. Message @Darryl_H with your order number and he can manually close it and release the notes.
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Collector livinitup921 private msg quote post Address this user
My invoice says my stuff is in labels, what’s the next step after that?
Post 327 IP   flag post
It was a one trick pony show but always hilarious. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by livinitup921
My invoice says my stuff is in labels, what’s the next step after that?

I believe:

heat seal
shipping
Post 328 IP   flag post
Collector Buckets private msg quote post Address this user
My Order placed 4/20 was for modern with VSP attached and has been in labels for 2-3 months.

On Monday Sept 13th I reached out to Darryl to inquire about the new timeline to processing the order and here was his reply:

On Tuesday, September 14, 2021, 07:35:57 AM PDT, Darryl Hayden <dhayden@cbcscomics.com> wrote:

This should be hitting shipping shortly. and I would think in the next week or two. I apologize for the delays

Today I called customer service and spoke with a very professional service rep.

After looking at my order, he stated it should be processed in another week or two and shipped.
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Collector Nearmint67 private msg quote post Address this user
Anyone else still waiting on books from the Al Ewing signing back in April?
Currently at 21 weeks on those.
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Former Forum Mascot ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user
@Buckets this is good for me since mine was received end of March. Ty
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I'd like to say I still turned out alright, but that would be a lie. flanders private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happyfacecomics
10-12 weeks is very normal TAT


That was a normal turnaround time before the collectibles market exploded. Now, the only way to get this turnaround time is to cut off the lower priced tiers. This is what PSA and BGS have done. The minimum fee to have a card graded through PSA is $150 and $125 through BGS. You personally can choose to have a 10-12 week turnaround or less with CBCS by paying between $36 to $90 per book. If not, be happy that CBCS is even allowing submissions at the lower tier. I like the fact that I can choose to wait longer and pay less than half the price for my submission as opposed to not being able to have most of my books graded at all, since the profit margin would be far too slim with the increased costs.
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COLLECTOR dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
@flanders Turnaround Times were down to 4-8 weeks for Moderns as recently as March of this year. The flood bit hard shortly afterward
Post 333 IP   flag post
It was a one trick pony show but always hilarious. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
I'd love 10-12 weeks TATs but who decides what's reasonable? There is a balance between TATs and cost.

@Happyfacecomics Do you want 10-12 week TATs for the same cost? Or are you willing to pay more?. They do have a Fast Press/Grade option for addition cost.

I don't pretend to know the nuances of how a grading company should be run. Anyone can say "throw bodies at the problem...hire, hire, hire" but if you stop and think about that, it's not that easy to do and not always the best response...may not even be feasible.

I'd wager that peoples comics are safer at CBCS than in their own homes. I get that people want to know where there books are but if they're asking that question while well inside the current TAT then they're wasting everyone's time. If CBCS has Received your books...patience is what's needed. Everyone will get their books back....everyone.
Post 334 IP   flag post
Collector Vengeance private msg quote post Address this user
I would like to say thank you to any and all that has helped my books along. As of now the email says they have been graded and shipped.

Again thank you.
Post 335 IP   flag post
Collector Petroman private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC

@Happyfacecomics Do you want 10-12 week TATs for the same cost? Or are you willing to pay more?. They do have a Fast Press/Grade option for addition cost.

Yes, I think this is where its all headed. Pay more to get your books graded in a "reasonable" timeframe. Otherwise, take the slow boat and shaddup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC

I don't pretend to know the nuances of how a grading company should be run. Anyone can say "throw bodies at the problem...hire, hire, hire" but if you stop and think about that, it's not that easy to do and not always the best response...may not even be feasible.

Agreed, it is not easy to scale up a business. But the fact that both CBCS and CGC have been bought by larger companies points to the fact that these are valuable businesses that are worth scaling up. I don't know much about Becketts or how well they are scaling up CBCS but the fact that CGC just got bought by Blackstone shows that the Wolves of Wall St. are getting in on the action. If its anything like Marvel going public in the early 90's we'll see explosive industry growth until the point where it all crashes and burns. Let's hope it's different this time!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC

I'd wager that peoples comics are safer at CBCS than in their own homes. I get that people want to know where there books are but if they're asking that question while well inside the current TAT then they're wasting everyone's time. If CBCS has Received your books...patience is what's needed. Everyone will get their books back....everyone.

An interesting point. How many folks go through the trouble and cost of getting separate insurance on their comics? With current prices many folks are no doubt sitting on books that can sell into the $1000's or even tens of $1000's. I doubt an insurance company would pay much for loss of these unless a separate rider was purchased. And that wouldn't come cheap.
Post 336 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
@flanders Maybe I'm the oddball here but I'd much rather keep my books raw than send them into grading limbo for an undeterminable span of time. Quick story. A friend of mine sent his TMNT books to CGC (because CBCS doesn't do magazines yet). They arrived in April 15th and were officially received May 26th. At that time the estimated TAT was 127 days. There's been zero movement on the books and the TAT now shows 213 days. Frustrated, he emailed them and just asked them to return his books. He even agreed to pay for return shipping. They of course said they couldn't do that and they can't guarantee TATs (kinda funny how the Certified Guaranty Company can't GUARANTEE anything), and they're doing their best and yada yada yada. As stated before, I understand that the TATs are estimates, but what's the point if they're so wildly off. The only purpose they serve is to give customers a false sense of transparency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC

I don't pretend to know the nuances of how a grading company should be run. Anyone can say "throw bodies at the problem...hire, hire, hire" but if you stop and think about that, it's not that easy to do and not always the best response...may not even be feasible.


There's a much simpler solution. A submission cap based on current staff capabilities, accompanied by a submission que system.
Pros:
- Books remain in your possession until they're ready to receive them
- Less storage space required at CBCS
- Less items for them to keep safe and insured
- Less manpower required to organize a never ending stream of deliveries
- Ability to control the inflow of books
- Easier to estimate TATs and more reliable information for us to base our purchase on
- Less dealing with angry customers wondering where their books are, (remember the good ol' days when all we complained about is the grades?)
- No working overtime or desperately hiring bodies
- Grow the company more naturally and increase submission cap accordingly

Cons:
- Fear that someone will be willing to wait 213 days with CGC?
- Easier for people to cancel submissions - which can be remedied with a non-refundable down payment

Curious if anybody can think of other negatives.

Continuing to take submissions does very little good for all parties involved. Especially considering they don't charge until the books move to the grading process anyway. As I've said before, I know everyone there is working hard but I can't wrap my head around the defense of the current model. Modern non-fast pass submissions could technically be in limbo indefinitely. I'm personally going on 7 weeks now waiting for my books to officially be received before my 17 week TAT clock even starts. If someone submits 1,000 2-day modern books tomorrow, I'm hosed. I understand from a business standpoint why the fast pass and higher tiers exist. But none of us would tolerate it if restaurants, hotels, travel agencies, or plumbers operated the same way. "Oh sorry sir, you have to wait a week to fly home because that lady over there paid $20 more for her ticket yesterday." "Yes sir, we understand that you booked your hotel 3 months ago, but last night 50 Cent and his crew came by and reserved every room". "Yes ma'am, we know you called us to fix your sewage leak today, but your neighbor paid us an extra $100 to fix her garbage disposal right now".

I know I'll eventually get my books back and I knew it would be a long wait. I'm not even really upset with my own situation...yet. But it's not like everything was smooth sailing before everyone went collectible crazy last year. Something has to change and I'd love for CBCS to take the lead. Steve B. practically created the whole slab grading thing to being with. All the more reason for him to perfect it.
Post 337 IP   flag post
Collector Bobashek private msg quote post Address this user
I don't think they could stop accepting submissions. I support a PC manufacturer and right now, the lead time on new builds exceeds 120 business days on certain models. There are thousands of businesses waiting on new equipment and they are just in the queue waiting. At least CBCS eventually posts updates. Better than I'm seeing in the technology world.
Post 338 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobashek
I don't think they could stop accepting submissions. I support a PC manufacturer and right now, the lead time on new builds exceeds 120 business days on certain models. There are thousands of businesses waiting on new equipment and they are just in the queue waiting. At least CBCS eventually posts updates. Better than I'm seeing in the technology world.


That’s a little different situation considering that’s most likely due to a component shortage. Not necessarily that they’re accepting more orders than they can physically build. If the grading companies were experiencing a plastic or ink shortage that would be comparable. Is this PC company accepting orders and not delivering in the 120 days? Are the businesses stuck buying from them even if they change that to 240 days? If a business offered to pay more would their order take precedence over all others?
Post 339 IP   flag post
Collector Bobashek private msg quote post Address this user
@Supertom, Yeah, lots of PC manufacturers continue to push their delivery dates out. You are right, it may not be a fair comparison. I was just using it to show that even though there may be a (labor) shortage which push delivery dates out, people who want the service will still order and just wait.
Post 340 IP   flag post
Collector CatCovers private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supertom
Curious if anybody can think of other negatives.


A multitude of customers get annoyed at being told CBCS doesn't want their business right now and take it elsewhere? "I may be waiting forever at CGC, but at least they're in the pipeline."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supertom
Continuing to take submissions does very little good for all parties involved. Especially considering they don't charge until the books move to the grading process anyway. As I've said before, I know everyone there is working hard but I can't wrap my head around the defense of the current model. Modern non-fast pass submissions could technically be in limbo indefinitely. I'm personally going on 7 weeks now waiting for my books to officially be received before my 17 week TAT clock even starts. If someone submits 1,000 2-day modern books tomorrow, I'm hosed. I understand from a business standpoint why the fast pass and higher tiers exist. But none of us would tolerate it if restaurants, hotels, travel agencies, or plumbers operated the same way. "Oh sorry sir, you have to wait a week to fly home because that lady over there paid $20 more for her ticket yesterday." "Yes sir, we understand that you booked your hotel 3 months ago, but last night 50 Cent and his crew came by and reserved every room". "Yes ma'am, we know you called us to fix your sewage leak today, but your neighbor paid us an extra $100 to fix her garbage disposal right now".


It's more like air travel. You can show up at the gate with your coach ticket six hours before the flight if you want, but the guy with the first class ticket who shows up with two minutes to spare still gets on and off the plane before you do.
Post 341 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
@CatCovers the Que system would still allow any and all customers to get their place in line. The only difference is you don’t have to ship your books until they’re ready to receive them.

The first class ticket buyer does get preferential treatment but their ticket purchase doesn’t bump you to the next flight. Regardless of your seat on the plane you both arrive at the same time.
Post 342 IP   flag post
Collector kidhuman private msg quote post Address this user
I have no issues waiting, I know that going in. What I would like is just to know that they have my books or not. To me they are in Limbo right now, like Schrodinger's books, CBCS has them and doesnt have them at the same tine. Once I know they are there safely, I am good. Its been just under 2 months and not an update on receiving them. A few weeks ago, some one posted a thread that they had they package opened and a book wasnt in there. Long story short, if they can ensure all the books are in a package, they should be able to update the webpage to received.
Post 343 IP   flag post
Collector CatCovers private msg quote post Address this user
@Supertom OK, let's work with one of your examples instead. Hotels and restaurants don't work, because reservations there are less for a service than for a specific date or time. Let's do plumbers. Say the plumber's website offers two tiers of service: Premium and Economy. Premium service means your job gets bumped to the top of the list and attended to by the next available crew. Economy service is less than half the price, but you have to wait on the list until they get to you, and if a Premium customer calls in with a clogged toilet, they go to the top of the list ahead of you. Knowing that, you choose Economy for the pricing. Your problem will get fixed, but you'll have to wait longer. You can't know all this, choose Economy, then complain when Premium goes first.

I understand; I want my books back too. My February submission has been in labels for 4+ weeks, and I'm antsy. But they'll be done when they're done.
Post 344 IP   flag post
Have I told you about the time I dropped off 3,000 comics at SDCC? Scifinator private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidhuman
I have no issues waiting, I know that going in. What I would like is just to know that they have my books or not. To me they are in Limbo right now, like Schrodinger's books, CBCS has them and doesnt have them at the same tine. Once I know they are there safely, I am good. Its been just under 2 months and not an update on receiving them. A few weeks ago, some one posted a thread that they had they package opened and a book wasnt in there. Long story short, if they can ensure all the books are in a package, they should be able to update the webpage to received.


@kidhuman - I think you may be referring to one of my submissions. In principle, I agree with you. But, in this particular environment whereby CBCS has been receiving massive amounts of submissions well beyond previous norms, I disagree. For them to stop their internal check-in process to make notification that a submission does not match what they received is a one off of what 1 in 100, 500, 1,000 or greater submissions? So, there wouldn’t be that great of delay to their internal check-in process. Now, how much time is take. To notify on every submission to the external system (the dashboard we see), I would imagine is an extremely time consuming venture. And, as such, In the interest of keeping TAT’s as low as possible and get caught up as soon as possible, i am all for temporarily putting the redundant service of dashboard notifications on the back burner. If you shipped in your submission, you should have tracking info from the carrier as proof of CBCS receipt. If you handed over at a Con, you should have been given a receipt by the CBCS personnel as proof.
Post 345 IP   flag post
Moderator Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supertom
... the Que system would still allow any and all customers to get their place in line. The only difference is you don’t have to ship your books until they’re ready to receive them.


If I understand this correctly, you want CBCS to set aside a slot of time to grade your books weeks in advance of the books being there. Then, as that time approaches, CBCS emails you, telling you they are ready for your books and you send them off. You send the books in, CBCS grades them according to when they tell you, and then they send them back to you. You don't see any problems to this flow chart? Because I see quite a few.

First off, this would require a submitter to fill out and submit an invoice before being scheduled. This invoice could not be changed in tiers or number of books due to the fact that the whole schedule depends on them having a fixed amount of submissions in fixed tiers at a fixed time. That's a problem if you know the customer base, comic collectors. Given 10 to 12 weeks before actually mailing the books in, a lot of people will want to change their invoices. That creates two scenarios. The first is that they can have customer service alter the submission. This would cause a ripple effect and could potentially throw off the other submissions. Or, people could cancel their invoice and create a new one for a later time slot. That would create an empty time slot, which would not be too bad due to there still being faster tiers.

Second, CBCS would be counting on the submitter to send off their comics in a timely manner. Good luck with that one!!!

Third, both CBCS and the submitter would be counting on the carrier to deliver the books in a timely manner. This would be problematic, at best, even in good situations. But during the Holidays, this would be disastrous!!!

Fourth, what happens if the books show up late? Does CBCS bump back another submission off the schedule to do the late one? Then that person does not get their books graded on time. All this would have a ripple effect that would get worse over time.

Lastly, with all the variables that could, and would, go wrong, what makes you think the complaining would be less or customer service would not be overtaxed? If anything, I see an increase in both happening under this que system.

Just my two cents.
Post 346 IP   flag post
Collector WMorse private msg quote post Address this user
How about a dynamic submission pricing system in response to supply/demand:

1) CBCS selects a base turnaround service timeframe "TST" (16 weeks?)
2) CBCS operations are categorized into service levels (red, yellow, green?).
3) When CBCS is operating within the base TST (green) pricing remains at the standard rate.
4) When CBCS is operating slightly outside of the base TST (yellow) pricing increases at a specified rate across the board for all services (+25%?).
5) Should the TST continue to increase and remain elevated (red), pricing increases again at a specified rate across the board for all services (+50%?) until green TST is achieved.

Two cents.
Post 347 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
@CatCovers I think hotels and restaurants are a pretty fair comparison because whether you're reserving a room or putting your name in for a table, you're committing to purchase goods/services based on the information available, be it a specific date or an approximate wait time. Higher priced suites or entrees don't grant you precedence over another patron. I'll admit they're not perfect analogies but my point was that if this model was used by other industries, we'd all hate it.

It is a fair point to say that if we know what we're getting we shouldn't complain. But we don't really know what we're getting, do we? In the example of my friends submission to CGC, he committed to spending hundred of dollars with the expectation his books would be back in approximately 127 days. Maybe 120 days, maybe 135 days. But surely not over 200 days! For me, I was anticipating 17-20 weeks, but I didn't expect it to take 2 months to even check them in. Heck, even a popup to say that they're experiencing higher than normal submissions so TATs may exceed 200% of estimates would at least be something to make customers aware. The average submitter has no clue what they're getting in to. Just look at the Better Business Bureau site for CGC. People are fed up with all the ambiguity and being left in the dark and it's going to really start hurting these businesses.

I'm not necessarily against higher tier/valued books getting graded more quickly. But I do take issue that my estimated TAT, the information I based my purchasing decision on, can change wildly at their complete discretion based on submissions they received weeks or maybe even months after mine.

@kidhuman I'm 100% with you. If simple data entry is "an extremely time consuming venture", then they've reached capacity and it's time to throttle new submissions and focus on customer service and output.
Post 348 IP   flag post
Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supertom
Higher priced suites or entrees don't grant you precedence over another patron. I'll admit they're not perfect analogies but my point was that if this model was used by other industries, we'd all hate it.


@Supertom I assure you this model is used by many other industries. USPS being the most glaring example. Everything works fine most of the year, but at Christmas time your non-priority package can take 10X as long.
When my brother was young he worked in the rental truck industry. Every Saturday he had families coming to his Penske shop in a panic. You see they had "reserved" a $29-a-day truck at U-Haul for their weekend move. When they went to get the truck, there were non available. They had a reservation but since U-Haul took no money they were free to rent those trucks out to the higher priced long distance rentals. They had no obligation to save them for the local $29 a-day local rentals...even though people had reservations. So at U-Haul, even with a reservation, you only get the truck if other people didn't rent them all out at higher prices for that day.
Not saying I don't appreciate and share your frustration. But you've spent days now dwelling on it and re-imagining someone else's business model. We've both expressed our frustrations. It's time to move on.
Post 349 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse_O
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supertom
... the Que system would still allow any and all customers to get their place in line. The only difference is you don’t have to ship your books until they’re ready to receive them.


If I understand this correctly, you want CBCS to set aside a slot of time to grade your books weeks in advance of the books being there. Then, as that time approaches, CBCS emails you, telling you they are ready for your books and you send them off. You send the books in, CBCS grades them according to when they tell you, and then they send them back to you. You don't see any problems to this flow chart? Because I see quite a few.


I think it's far simpler than that.

1) We fill out the online submission form as we do now. 10-20% down payment to ensure people don't cancel or change their submission willy nilly.
2) You receive a confirmation email with an approximate wait time before shipping. This is based on their current submission load. They don't have to blindly factor in future submissions. You have your spot in line, that spot doesn't change regardless of future submissions.
3) Once they are ready you get an email saying, "We're ready to receive your books!" They could even provide a prepaid shipping label so they can control tracking and speed. If you ship late, or change your submission you run the risk of losing your spot in line.

Everything else operates as normal. Once the books arrive, the TAT clock starts. I'm not saying they have to book you a time slot or guarantee the TAT down to the day. But if they can control the inflow of submissions, the TAT for each tier would never change. It may still take 17 weeks from start to finish but the bulk of that time, the books would remain in your possession.
Post 350 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
@EbayMafia Ah, if only we could we all strive to function as well as the USPS. Not obsessing, I just enjoy the thought experiment and hearing other perspectives. I think we've all acknowledged that the current model is frustrating at best. If we all just sit back and except the status quo then nothing will ever change.
Post 351 IP   flag post
Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
@Supertom The problem with these ideas is, as you think them through completely, you eventually realize that the best business decision is to just eliminate the lower priced Modern tier. I mean if you are predicting long wait times far enough into the future to warrant a complete overhaul, why not just eliminate the low profit tiers and reduce the backlogs? Profit is not based on how much comes in the front door, it's based on how much can go out the back door.
Post 352 IP   flag post
Collector Petroman private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbayMafia
@Supertom The problem with these ideas is, as you think them through completely, you eventually realize that the best business decision is to just eliminate the lower priced Modern tier. I mean if you are predicting long wait times far enough into the future to warrant a complete overhaul, why not just eliminate the low profit tiers and reduce the backlogs? Profit is not based on how much comes in the front door, it's based on how much can go out the back door.

Bingo! IMHO, this is where it is all going. At a minimum, shutdown the lower profit tiers, mainly Modern, when it is "full". There is just no way that these companies would have the warehouse space to securely store an ever growing horde of books, nor would they likely be increasing their insurance premiums to cover this mass of unprocessed books. So yeah, just shutdown (or possibly eliminate, but I don't see the higher up suits going for this) the cheap tiers in times of excessive submissions. If you *really* want your Modern books graded, you can always pony up for 2-day Modern, Quickstream etc.
Post 353 IP   flag post
Collector Supertom private msg quote post Address this user
@EbayMafia @Petroman I agree with both of you. But the idea isn't to just fix their current problem, but to prevent this from ever happening again. If they could just control the flow of books in, there would be no need to predict crazy long wait times or increase insurance premiums.
Post 354 IP   flag post
Collector Petroman private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supertom
@EbayMafia @Petroman I agree with both of you. But the idea isn't to just fix their current problem, but to prevent this from ever happening again. If they could just control the flow of books in, there would be no need to predict crazy long wait times or increase insurance premiums.

I think if they were to go with any type of order based queueing it would need to be pretty simplistic and not a complex workflow revolving around scheduled mailings. A real simple way would to just only allow a user to create a new submission if they 1) have no submissions currently in progress (or maybe allow 1 in progress, etc.) and 2) Have not created a new submission in the last X amount of time (week, month, 60 days, etc). Yeah, you may get some users who create multiple accounts, but there could be ways to prevent this.
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