Batman: Robin coming out as bisexual was 'missing piece' of story15456
 Pictures? We don't need no stinking pictures.
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brysb private msg quote post Address this user | |
| So after all of these years Tim Drake decides he is gay/bi? Ok, whatever. Notice they didn't make Damian Wayne gay, but instead went with Tim Drake who is a more disposable character and just 1 in a string of Robins. Maybe we will get a gay bashing/Joker story arc & it ends with Tim Drake getting beaten to death with a crow bar? Later he is resurrected in the Lazarus Pit just like Jason Todd, but instead of a Red Hood he will don a Disco Ball on his head. | ||
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KYDU private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Lazy and easy writing. Create your own character not retroactively change a well established character, or at least go the route of say creating a Miles Morales. This is like self serving fan fiction.(Yes I can do better DC, just give me a 6 to 12 issue run). To be fair I haven’t read the storyline so not sure of the context and the writer may be amazing. |
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 I've spent years perfecting my brand of assholery.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by dfoster43 Yes, and most of the stories sparkle like Twilight. |
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 How do I know this? Because I've done it myself.
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lawguy1977 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'll dip my feet in the pool here for a couple minutes and then move on to dinner and a beer. 1. Read what you love. If you don't like it, don't read it. Great thing about this world -- especially in the world of comics, tv, movies, books, etc., there's so much damn content available now. 2. Personally, I don't equate this move the same as the Bat Dong. That was clearly for headlines and had absolutely nothing to do with the story. It was just a way to get the Black Label some press. 3. Totally agree that new characters can be a focus for diversity. We've seen that with probably the best example in the past 20 years -- Miles Morales, which someone referenced earlier. However, at the same time, there's a lot of joking about the million Robins that have been around, which is very fair. 50% of Gotham has been Robin at this point. So, if DC created a new bisexual character and said, "Here's our new Robin," I think a lot of folks would come out and say that's it lazy writing and just done solely to create a bisexual Robin for the sake of diversity and that this Robin is not a real "Robin." Regardless if DC had Tim Drake (or a different Robin) come out or they create a brand new bisexual Robin, people would criticize the move as a "ploy." And yes, you can easily say it is a ploy to get new readers or cater to political correctness, diversity, current social trends, or as a means to force indoctrination into children, whatever, feel free to stand on a milk crate and yell about it. Simple fact is that superhero comics have tackled social issues for decades -- racism, drug or alcohol addiction, etc. The world hated the X-Men. Tony was an alcoholic. Speedy was an addict. Peter Parker was an orphan. Big stuff for what is supposed to be kids books. But maybe some kid read that and could relate and feel a little bit better about his or her life. Or feel like someone out there understands them. Anyway, for me, the question really comes down to how this whole thing came about. Has anyone actually read the story where Tim Drake came out as bisexual? Was it forced or contrived? Or was it a natural progression of how the character was being written? I haven't read the story so I can't say. But for me, it all comes down to the writing. If it makes sense, then the writer did a good job. If it's a bulls*** ploy, then the readers are going to recognize that and it won't hold up. And maybe, just maybe, some kid out there is reading it and thinks, "Hey, if Robin is bisexual and can help kick ass with Batman, then maybe it's ok if I'm bi, too." Well, that's pretty empowering, I'd say. |
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jesseaweiss private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by brysb People discover things about themselves in all stages of life. While it's becoming more common, it unusual for people to come out before they are at least out of HS (because of bullying) or into their 20's and more established. Personally I think it's more authentic to have someone change over time than to just drop a new character. |
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jesseaweiss private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by KatKomics I think you're projecting your likes onto other people, particularly the younger audience. In my experience with teens and tweens (parent and 25 yr teacher) the kids that are into comic books are not looking just for villain story arcs. They are looking for more complex stories including personal strife, etc... I would argue it's what saved comics in the late 80's/early 90's. |
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OGJackster private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by jesseaweiss Thanks for your input, interesting viewpoint! |
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 If the viagra is working you should be well over a 9.8.
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xkonk private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'm not a Batman reader but I think they did introduce a new character not that long ago, and we had a thread where people were upset with her haircut. Maybe the writers shouldn't listen to us too much. | ||
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 Looking for love in all the wrong places.
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robo private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by OGJackster Don't think he was in high school or concerned about being bullied but I know little to no specific facts on it - didn't read either - but so much appears forced, fake - making the quota of x # race, X alt. sex, and X females. I'd bet it's phony - not knowing anything outside that 'they' made Robin bi - think they tried doing that to SpongeBob too - the dude's a sponge and his creator died. |
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OGJackster private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @lawguy1977 Well said. | ||
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jesseaweiss private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by robo Sorry I wasn't implying that he was a certain age, just pointing out that many people discover things, or allow themselves to be honest about themselves, at stages in life where they feel less constricted by their environment. As for making quotas, is it odd for writers to want characters to reflect reality? Even if driven by the economics of selling books, it's more likely they are trying to be relatable to as many people as possible. Why are 12% of protagonists female, when >50% of people are and 40% of comic fans are? Sticking to economics, that's a huge marketing miss. I'm really not sure what you think is "phony". This is fiction. It's all phony. Everything written and drawn reflects the viewpoint of the writer/artist and the company that publishes it. It is certainly reasonable that the viewpoints of those creating Batman would have change as the world changes. Comic book characters get retconned all the time to better fit the times. |
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 Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It's interesting to go to Barnes and Noble and check out the teen/young adult section of the store. You realize very quickly who the young customers are for books. It seems to be a mostly for the kids who consider themselves outside the "mainstream" of youth. Not the athletes, more the drama students and band members and kids searching their "non-traditional" identity. It's probably always been this way actually. | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Amazing how many people can have a solidly formed, definite opinion of a book or story they admittedly have not read , nor followed. I think if you want to take a baseball bat to something , should at least make an effort to thoroughly examine it and determine that is what is called for. I havent read the story so put myself in a position here to both lack and refuse to offer any opinion until I am at least familar with the plot and story. My own two cents is what feels forced is a comic book world that has supposedly never had gay, trans, or LGBT members. It is how our world today is like it or not.....I remember discovering around the same time that both Joan Jett and Samantha Fox were not playing for the team I had always assumed...and feeling crushed! Each his own I guess |
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I think that better route would be to create a new character/Robin. Make him compelling. Then maybe a year or so he comes out as gay/bi. It's an odd change to make to a 30-year old character, y'know? |
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dfoster43 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by lawguy1977 OK I'll be the one to ask, I'm not ashamed of my ignorance ... Bat Dong??  The only Black Label I remember is Carling, a cheap Brit lager with a nasty hangover quotient LOL  |
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PLOD
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by dfoster43 Batman: Damned #1 1st print has an outline of Bruce Wayne's hot dog in a panel where he was in the shadows. |
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dfoster43 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by theCapraAegagrus Ahh. Well that is disturbing AND informative. Thanks! |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| But noone said Robin changed...people really arent getting that...he is saying he was always like this but has only now announced it, which to be honest, fits many people in society who spend much of their lives hiding their private preferences. Noone changed anything if you understand the narrative, they simply gave you more information. | ||
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Towmater private msg quote post Address this user | |
| My view on it is that I’m not the audience that they are attempting to target. For those that want to argue that x percentage of the population is this or that so comics need to reflect society within their pages. I would hope that you will also fight to have the comic industry reflect that roughly 42% of the population in the USA over 20 years of age is obese. Under the % of the population is this or that argument, the comic industry should then tackle that mentally and physically challenges associated with obesity, and the health issues associated with being obese. Story arcs with heroes, villains, and regular folk should be welcome as almost ½ of the people reading comics are dealing with the issues associated with being overweight/obese. It would shine a light on the issue and possibly provide a helping hand as the issue of obesity effects everyone in our society due to the costs associated with it. Before the term “costs” triggers anyone I am not just writing about the financial costs here. The “costs” take many forms and we all bear them. (I don't foresee the industry suddenly making 40% of the characters in their books obese nor reflecting the society they inhabit appear that way either). |
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PLOD
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Retcons are changes. | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| but....nothing was retractively changed about the character, he simply provided MORE information about who he is and has always been. Therefore it isnt a retcon.... | ||
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Looking for love in all the wrong places.
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robo private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by TowmaterI zoned out some. Diet and lifestyle comics for fat people? That's just what this industry needs. Bi-Robin just sounds lazy, convenient - the gay thing - baiting - that's what the kids call it. Like me - not that I'm gay - "but willing to learn" - Stripes. Comic character are also the majority - elites of our species. A few of them 40%'ers(fatties) slipped in there too - but ya'll try to eliminate carbs and sugar from your diet. Less calories in - ya just being a 'Bi-Robin' - lazy and convenient. But no worries we got a comic for that. Cheers |
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 Beaten by boat oars
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Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Was it this controversial when Cartman came out 1/2 bisexual on South Park in 2003? He became a 1/4 bisexual about four seconds later while Craig became a catamite. | ||
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
| He was retconned from being hetero to bi. After 30 years. | ||
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Studley_Dudley Everything that Cartman does is controversial.  |
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I would challenge you to show me anywhere they stated he was heterosexual or anything else for that matter. Because you have chosen to assume it for years, you now assume it means he changed. He did not, you simply failed to allow for the possibility so when it was made known you label it a retcon. Failed logic ....they never said what he was. | ||
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Exclusively heterosexual relationships for 30 years is more than enough evidence, I would say. No assumptions necessary. There's a reason that he hasn't been hinted as bi in the last 30 years, because he wasn't. That's a retcon. | ||
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 -Our Odin-Rest in Peace |
Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by theCapraAegagrus What about his relationship with Connor Kent? Here's a good article refuting your stance that there wasn't any hints. Screenrant article |
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jesseaweiss private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by theCapraAegagrus How is that a given? Unless it was expressly stated he was hetero, nothing in his past would indicate he wasn't always bi. We also have to keep in mind that it's 30 years of stories, but not 30 years in the character's life. My understanding is he's currently 16 in the comics. As for the idea that this was out of nowhere, Tim's sexuality has been alluded to subtly for about 20 years particularly in terms of his relationship with Superboy. When asked about a 2003 comic where they were shown in a closet together in a scene, the writer said it was an "opportunity for them to come out of the closet" (this was in 2018). So for about 2/3 of the time the character has existed the question of his sexuality has been written into his story. They didn't make Tim bi, they decided it was the right time to have Tim start coming to grips openly with his sexuality. Ans just to clarify, the character has not "come out" as bi or anything else. He accepted a date offer from a boy, that's it. https://screenrant.com/robin-bisexual-tim-drake-clues-superboy-conner/ |
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theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Jesse_O I don't see that as a "hint", but if we want to take the writer's word for it 15 years later... |
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