CGC vs CBCS grading14999
 Collector
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deczola private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I received my first set of books ever graded by CBCS and a few of them were CGC graded. I took them out of the CGC cases because they were Qualified Green Labels and had authentic signatures. I was thinking I will get it verified by CBCS and that will increase the value. I was in shock on how much harder CBCS graded over CGC. I will post some photos when I have a chance, but here are a few examples: New Mutants #98 CGC 9.4 - this issue had some light paper bends that didn't break color. I pressed it myself and the finished product was at least one step up (9.6). CBCS Grade with BAS Liefield Sig verification = 9.0 I was shocked. CGC 9.4 IMPROVED after a pressing and not only did I not get the 9.6 I got a 9.0 Sandman #1 CGC 9.6 Qualified - I expected the same grade Sandman #1 CBCS BAS Sig Verified Gaiman and Keith is now a 9.4 Sandman #4 CGC 9.8 Qualified - again expected the same grade Sandman #4 CBCS BAS Sig Verified Gaiman is now a 9.6 Is CBCS that hard of a grader? I cannot say who but I know one person who grades for CGC and he ws speechless on the grades. Thoughts guys and gals? |
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| Post 1 • IP flag post | ||
 The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The opposite can be asked. Is CGC that lax in grading? A majority of folks will say that CBCS is more consistent not harsher. |
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| Post 2 • IP flag post | ||
 I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Not to cause a broo-haha here but I don't think CBCS's grading is harder than CGCs....I think CBCSs grading is more accurate...considerably more accurate. CGCs grading, IMO, is considerably more lax. | ||
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Collector
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deczola private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by GAC Might I ask you this question - I know CGC takes into consideration manufacturer errors in comic grading. A example would be most new formats have a flat front and back covers (say Wolverine Claremont starting at issue 1). The spine is of course going to have wear. Every single issue for my Sandman signed issues got a grader remark of color break when there was none, it just is inherent in every issue. I also got back a Doom Patrol #19 signed by Case. 9.6....only reason it is not a 9.8 is "pebbling" which every single issue printed has that issue. |
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 Collector
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| its really a function of human nature though isnt it..if its your own book, and you own it, there is no doubt that is a 9.6 and is nice even then for that grade.... but if you are buying it, those staple tics bring it down, and the slight rub at the corner is enough it does lose a notch or two...its only a 9.0 sorry........ Everyone thinks their own is the best grade, and the one they are buying is lower than the seller feels it is. |
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have no dog in this fight and I know you weren't talking to me, but in my opinion, the only person qualified to answer your questions are that of the actual employees of CBCS. Nobody knows their criteria except for them. | ||
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 Collector
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Terry88 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| A lot of what you're describing is exactly why grading is kind of ridiculous. There are no real "set rules" for what's acceptable. All we get are evaluations of the cumulative defects that are or aren't present. In my opinion, if books "all" come with a given defect that should be reflected in the lack of 9.8's being seen in the wild. That's how grading should work, but it clearly doesn't. Grading shouldn't just be available to categorize defects "people introduce" into books, it NEEDS to account for printing issues as well - but in a lot of cases, that isn't what we see in the final graded product. I feel this is where a lot of graded books loose credibility and where I personally loose interest in having more books graded. Oh, and this isn't a knock on either CGC or CBCS, just an observation. In general CBCS will appear to grade harder as they tend to stick closer to a fixed set of rules. But don't forget this is a business, some companies want your repeat business. Who would you be more likely to resubmit to, the company giving out token 9.8's or the company providing more accurate grades? It sucks, but that's the reality. |
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 Collector
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Sebastsk8 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| At the same time I'm sure there are books that go the opposite way too. Human error always plays a role in grading. It does seem CBCS tends to be more accurate with their grades, but any grading company could have that happen if someone happens to overlook something tiny, maybe they didnt sleep well the night before or didnt have their morning coffee etc. It happens to them all. |
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| Post 8 • IP flag post | ||
 I called CGC about the giveback benefit.
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beastboy1980 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| to me its a mute subject once a book is cracked its all bets off | ||
| Post 9 • IP flag post | ||
 I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| My 2 cents is that when Steve jumped ship from CGC he brought with him his own ideas of what constitutes a particular grade. Also, he probably came to the conclusions based on what he saw. | ||
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Collector
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deczola private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Bronte I am entirely new here but who do I talk to when it involves a known manufacturer error (maybe they aren't aware of it)? When I first was going to send comics to CBCS I called them in early February to ask how their signature verification works. While talking to the employee (sounded like he was from India which I thought was strange) I told them a few were CGC graded and he told me don't open the case and CBCS will match the rating. I already opened a few of them not knowing this and because I could see the New Mutants issue would be a bump up on a press I thought, no harm no foul. So I guess for the future I will send CBCS my graded 9.8 in CGC case to guarantee I get the same grade when I need the Signature Verification. |
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I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @deczola welcome to the boards | ||
| Post 12 • IP flag post | ||
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @deczola Someone gave you wrong information. Previous company grade has no bearing on your book. The books are graded by their own merit regardless of where they came from. Raw or graded. |
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Collector
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deczola private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Comicninja0215 Thank you sir! | ||
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I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
 @Bronte |
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| Post 15 • IP flag post | ||
 Have I told you about the time I dropped off 3,000 comics at SDCC?
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Scifinator private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by GAC @GAC - Some day maybe a lot of us can get together for some brews and haha’s. In the meantime, in my humble opinion, you are pretty much on the mark. CBCS is more strict in their accuracy and adherence to grading standards, while cgc is more lax in its accuracy and standards. Way too many anecdotal samples to suggest otherwise. I have no concern about grading accuracy if I buy a coming in a CBCS encasement, whereby I have a rule to buying cgc slabs only at lower grade pricing as i see too many cases of cgc overgrades. |
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| Post 16 • IP flag post | ||
 I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Bronte Somewhat related: If you have a CGC Yellow Label, keep it in the slab and CBCS will honor the signature and also place it in a yellow label. There had been a date cutoff for this, but I believe it now stands for any CGC Yellow Label. The grade could, however, change. |
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| Post 17 • IP flag post | ||
 Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The thing we say publicly is that CBCS grading is more strict and CGC grading is more lax. The thing we know privately is that lax always means looser, not tighter. | ||
| Post 18 • IP flag post | ||
 If I could, I would. I swear.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It seems to me that the problem might be that you pressed your own books. Do any of your CBCS grader's notes mention pebbling, waffling, or canvassing? |
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| Post 19 • IP flag post | ||
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Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| We tend to equivocate a lot and talk about, subjectivity, different standards, etc, etc and that probably makes sense for grades from 4.0-9.0. But when we're talking about grades of 9.4, 9.6 and 9.8 there is absolutely no rationalizing consistent differences. If the two companies are not about 99% in agreement on those grades, it means that someone is grading incorrectly. | ||
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 Collector
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BrooksRobinson private msg quote post Address this user | |
| This is why it baffles me that cgc books go for more than the same grade cbcs copies on ebay. You’re paying more for a book that is often in worse condition, all for a label 🤷♂️ | ||
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I wish I had a title.
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ComicNinja0215 private msg quote post Address this user | |
@BrooksRobinson ching ching!!!!!!! |
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Collector
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It seems to me that if you only care what the number at the top of the slab reads, and not if the actual grade is correct and a critical appraisal of the condition of the enclosed comic book, why not just send them off to CGC and have them redone so they can have the numbers on the slab you feel CGC would place on them? Problem resolved. Anymore when someone asks if I can grade a book I am seriously tempted to ask, by CGC standards or CBCS.... I own books done by both companies albeit quite a few more from CGC. I can say this much..in those higher grades...9.4, 9.6 and 9.8 the comics sure do present much better than similar book grades given by CGC. I have no issue paying MORE for a CBCS slab than same grade book in a CGC cause normally its a nicer book overall. Guess it comes down to the simple concept do you want the slabs to read CGC and have generous grades or CBCS and have strict grading that is quite thorough |
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| Post 23 • IP flag post | ||
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Darkseid_of_town I think he / she wanted to get rid of green labels. Hence the authentication need of CBCS... |
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Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Question: Quote: Originally Posted by DrWatson Answer: Quote: Originally Posted by deczola Is there some kind of database of manufacturing errors that the grading companies can access? I ask this as a serious question. It must be really hard with modern books to know what errors are systemic to which books. |
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Collector
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Terry88 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I feel like overlooking an obvious book defect just because it might be systematic from printing (just as an example) completely goes against the point of grading/evaluating the condition of books when it's supposed to be an unsubjective service. Just my opinion. |
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| Post 26 • IP flag post | ||
 I'll probably wake up constipated.
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Pre_Coder private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by BrooksRobinson $$$,$$$,$$$ |
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| Post 27 • IP flag post | ||
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I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Pre_Coder Yup! the reality is, many people want the higher grade over the more accurate lower grade. |
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| Post 28 • IP flag post | ||
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Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'm still hoping we will get to see the books and grader notes to form a "tighter" opinion on this issue. | ||
| Post 29 • IP flag post | ||
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If I could, I would. I swear.
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DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by EbayMafia An incorrectly pressed book will pebble. That and canvassing are two of the hallmarks of a poor press job. |
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