By the numbers comparison: CGC vs. CBCS (hint: CBCS wins HARD)14689
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mediaslave private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town I can choose pretty much any book, and almost every time the same book, in the same grade, on the same platform, in the same sales style, will sell for less as a CBCS book. I didn't get destroyed. I just stopped trying to have a reasonable conversation over an easily provable conclusion thats well known by every collector out there with the type of person that says something at a party that makes everybody just stop and stare at them. |
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| Post 76 • IP flag post | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I get it...use insults. It isn't attractive and it doesn't rescue your argument but it makes you feel less threatened. Incidentally, if it is an "easily proveable" conclusion, lets see proof. Not cherry picked data, verifiable proof. I will await your research |
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| Post 77 • IP flag post | ||
 I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson This is actually a great point. We all know Bigred won't touch even a slightly miswrapped book where for me, not really a big deal. Two books, same grade, I'd consider buying both but Bigred would likely only consider one...and there's so many more examples beside miswraps. |
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| Post 78 • IP flag post | ||
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town Honestly I stopped reading what was being written after someone threw in "science" or "scientific method". If one book sells for more money if it's graded by CGC than CBCS and multiple sales data proves it then I go with that. It's not science, but common sense. Sure, there are some factors that impact the price, such as page quality and Direct/Newsstand, but I dont't care if one ended on a Sunday while the other ended on a Tuesday. If multiple CGC books sell for more than a similar graded CBCS book then to me, it's a fact for that particular book. You may not agree with it and that's fine. |
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| Post 79 • IP flag post | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Correct it is fine. Some require a burden of proof, actual facts while others accept things at face value. Incidentally while the scientific method does not claim to prove anything but instead offers the most accurate hypothesis based on evidence, the alternative then proves even less as it requires less burden of proof. Simple enough for me... I will continue requiring hard evidence and facts rather than innuendo and circumstantial bias. |
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| Post 80 • IP flag post | ||
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mediaslave private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town Sure. Name 3 books. *** This might be harder than I thought. I just searched out 20 different books, and couldn't even find CBCS versions of most... |
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| Post 81 • IP flag post | ||
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Scientific data...are we talking about CGC or the CDC? | ||
| Post 82 • IP flag post | ||
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mediaslave private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town Thankfully the massive majority of the market doesn't actually care what you require, and will just happily ignore your self-delusion while continuing to pay less for CBCS books for their collections. Everyone wins! Woot! |
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| Post 83 • IP flag post | ||
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mediaslave private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by GAC Thats a great point actually, really great. I sold an ASM 300 9.6 because I didn't agree with the grade, thought it deserved a 9.4. Unfortunately, I sold it about 6 months before the explosion...doh. |
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| Post 84 • IP flag post | ||
 Thank you sir. May I have another?
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Siggy private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DrWatson While I still can... I personally agree with this- Not in terms of an auction, which I haven't done in years, but suddenly hot books already on list that I "need" to get before they're caught up and driven up. If I see a book I want and my only two comparable options are in both slabs, same grade, same price (based on CGC GPA), and the CBCS book looks better to me (better centering, whatever the reason), I have zero problem paying what CGC's go for for the CBCS. It's the book that matters. |
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| Post 85 • IP flag post | ||
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Sebastsk8 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Personally I do enough searching and ebay/amazon/mcs/etc perusing to know the price difference does exist at least in higher demand books. I'm not saying that exists in all books, but from my fairly obsessive hunt for certain books this year it's been pretty obviously clear. ASM 300 is a perfect example, although obviously the cbcs graded copies rose in value a ton too, the cgc ones just end up reaching a little higher peak. Not that that has anything to do with cbcs as a grading company, or their cases, etc. Hell, a good portion of it could even be people purposefully searching for "amazing spiderman 300 cgc" thus there being more eyes on the books to drive up auction prices. But it does happen. Luckily for me, I'm just as happy to pick up a cbcs slab, especially if it's for a lower price. |
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| Post 86 • IP flag post | ||
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mediaslave private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Siggy This is definitely true. On the real hot stuff, the gap lessens or can even disappear. I don't find that happens often, but I have seen it. UF4 is a good example. ASM 300 yeah, smaller gap, but still there. I'm hunting for a Batman 404 9.8, and I'm pissed that I missed the last one by CBCS because it went under the CGC price by 30%. |
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| Post 87 • IP flag post | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DEnot sure it would matter if you require FACTUAL data.....anything that requires evidence to make a determination requires factual evidence rather than gossip and bias. facts are facts, anything less is ...why yes, less. |
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| Post 88 • IP flag post | ||
 Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't disagree with @mediaslave, the sum of my unscientific observations tells me that the market as a whole still prefers CGC slabs. But I've also pointed out how that ironically has worked to my advantage in a hot market, the quicker sales of the CGC listings gave me opportunity to adjust my prices upwards, making me hundreds if not thousands of extra sales dollars this year. However, I'm surprised that @Darkseid_of_town didn't share the observation he made recently of what would also seem to be an irrational market: The last X-men 1 3.0 sold for more than the last 3.5 which sold for more than the last 4.0. We all know that this is not a sign that the market prefers 3.0 over 4.0. |
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| Post 89 • IP flag post | ||
 You can't get good wood on the ball every time.
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HotKeyComics private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I'm going to work on a more in depth set of numbers over the next couple weeks and put them together to get some more data. If there's a specific issue(s) you want me to include, pm me and I'll add it to the list. |
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| Post 90 • IP flag post | ||
 If the viagra is working you should be well over a 9.8.
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xkonk private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I can't remember if I posted it or not (I think I did, probably in a very similar thread that got locked), but I went through the last comiclink auction that closed and pulled all the comparable CGC/CBCS books. There weren't a lot; maybe 10-15. The CGC's sold for a bit more but not enough that you would be statistically confident that CGC consistently sells for more (I think statistics is the 'science' that everyone is looking for?). I don't think many people have a good grasp on how many data points you need to "prove" something when you're talking about numbers as variable as comic sales. Which doesn't mean that CGC doesn't sell for more, just that you need a lot of data to feel confident about it. | ||
| Post 91 • IP flag post | ||
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The CGC's sold for a bit more but not enough that you would be statistically confident that CGC consistently sells for more (I think statistics is the 'science' that everyone is looking for?). I don't think many people have a good grasp on how many data points you need to "prove" something when you're talking about numbers as variable as comic sales Solid gold right there.... Agreed, few people seem to have a grasp or even be in touch with reality about what constitutes a statistical fact. Apparently if you see a few sales that support your view, and it looks close, why bother checking it and verifying if there other factors. After all, fudging the data to match your bias is apparently only common sense. And for the record, yes you did post those results for everyone previously in a similar post, in response to same op making similar claims before. |
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| Post 92 • IP flag post | ||
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xvipah private msg quote post Address this user | |
| ASM 300: clickable text Not factual evidence, but anecdotal and a small sample size from just 1 source. There are 4 slabbed 9.6 ASM 300's (1 CBCS and 3 CGC) for sale on MCS. These are consignments, so the person selling sets the price not MCS themselves. But the CBCS slab is priced the lowest, with only 1 of the other 3 within $160. The rest are WAY higher. Now, again, these are sellers pricing them not "experts". However, those people (who presumably know at least a little bit about comics and the marketplace right now) obviously feel at least a little comfortable with the idea of sitting 1k+ over the CBCS slab price with their CGC slab. Maybe they won't sell, maybe they'll drop the price before they do. I have no idea. But the trend is easy to see. Another small, but telling, sample size, ST 110: clickable text CGC 3.5 almost double the CBCS 2.5, and the CGC 2.0 selling for more than the CBCS 2.5. I'm not trying to cherry pick here. I just haven't found a major key, yet, that this trend isn't similar on MCS, if there even are CBCS slabs for sale to compare to. Again, by the time all of these sell the prices could be dropped or offers made that bring them all in to parity. I don't even know if MCS has a sold items feature to compare them there or not. But, regardless of facts, the market, or at least the people I can find selling in to the market, seems fairly certain that CGC slabs sell for more. Regardless of real value or quality. |
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| Post 93 • IP flag post | ||
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Masculinity takes a holiday.
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EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by xvipah @xvipah If you look at the ASM 300 that is up for auction you can click on "Sales Data" and see that the CBCS 9.6 price is the one that is most closely related to historical sales data. I think what you are seeing is that sellers who send CBCS comics to MCS are more about selling them at todays FMV. We're probably smaller fish on the whole and we are sending books in with intent to sell. Some bigger guys have been known to use MCS as a secure storage facility while they wait for prices to rise. MCS had to change their policies recently because of this. |
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| Post 94 • IP flag post | ||
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