Manufacturer's Error?13822
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 Collector
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ggovel private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I recently picked up a copy of Maestro: War & Pax #1 and discovered that it was missing multiple pages. Does anyone know how CBCS treats a manufacturer's error like this? Would it affect the grade? Would it not affect the grade, but have the error noted on the label? Any info would be appreciated. For info on this error, check out: http://collectorsyndicate.com/masetro-war-pax-1-error/ Thanks in advance. |
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 Collector
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Beeda private msg quote post Address this user | |
| No clue, but curious to find out | ||
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 Thank you sir. May I have another?
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Siggy private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Missing pages or missing wraps? | ||
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 Collector
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steveinthecity private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SiggyFour wraps. |
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 Collector
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Redmisty4me private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by ggovel You're asking about slabbing/grading, but I think you may ultimately be asking a value question. If so, note that printing errors which enhance value (multiple covers perhaps the best example) are few and far between, and that most printing errors detract from value. Coin/stamp errors which involve some form of defacement or other problem are highly valued because they must pass through so many quality checks & so few are released, but any drunk with a printing press can screw up a magazine, and would if there were money in it. If this isn't your ultimate interest, please forgive my intrusion. |
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Collector
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ggovel private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Redmisty4me Thanks for your thoughts on this. While I am asking how CBCS handles this scenario in grading/slabbing, you make a good point as to what makes an error desirable/collectible. For example the Blue Lizard Spider-Man #1, or more recently the Batman #89 with blacked out page(s) could be attributed to a “drunk with a printing press”, but those books became collectible. I’d be interested in hearing people’s further thoughts on this. |
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 I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @ggovel - I have owned a Superman vs. Muhammad Ali Treasury for a number of years. It is not high grade, maybe around a 5.0 or 6.0. It has several pages that are not present, and several wraps that are repeated. I always wondered if it would be considered "incomplete" because although it has the correct number of pages, they do not go in sequence and some #'s are missing. I am sure it is a manufacturer's defect, but have not heard of any other copies with this error. The only way I could get it graded is through the CBCS Raw Grade option. I wonder how they would handle it, and if it would be sought after by any error collectors. | ||
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 CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Point five, incomplete. No matter how it happened, it's missing pages and is incomplete. | ||
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I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SteveRicketts That's what I thought, but it has the correct number of pages, just doubles of some and none of others. Pretty weird. If we ever get back to conventions and you make your way to New England, I'd be happy to show it to you. |
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I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
@SteveRicketts - And by that line of thinking, should this have been graded as a 0.3 coverless copy because it has the wrong cover? And why was it identified as Wolverine #25 on the CBCS label, when the book is actually Ghost Rider? |
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 I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by esaravo This is interesting and I get what you're saying Ed. If we assume the book is correct and the cover is wrong, then the label is incorrect. If we assume the cover is correct and the book is wrong then the label is correct....its the chicken and egg puzzle. Maybe the covers are always considered correct for labels? |
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I live in RI and Rhode Islanders eat chili with beans.
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esaravo private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @GAC - That's why I post these things, Angelo - because I want to know the answers. If a book has the correct number of pages, but some are duplicates that take the place of others, is it still considered incomplete? And does the cover determine what the book is, or is it the contents/actual book? You would think there would be a straight answer to these questions. or is it up to the grader at at the time, or does each company have different rules? | ||
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CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by esaravo My apologies if I misunderstood the original post. If a book is supposed to have 8 wraps and is missing 4 wraps, it is incomplete and would get a point five grade. If the book is supposed to have 8 wraps and has the same 4 wraps inserted twice, it would technically get a standard grade but be noted as a manufacturing error. |
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CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by esaravo When we first opened, this specific type of error was discussed, and there is a good argument for both sides. We ultimately came to the decision that for te sake of confusion in the marketplace, we would go with the label matching the cover. If the title on the label were different than the book, it would just look like we labeled the comic incorrectly. As it is, it goes back to my post before this one. It has the correct number of wraps inside, even though they are the incorrect wraps. Thus it is a manufacturing error. |
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Jabberwookie private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SteveRicketts This is excellent insight into what you all have to wrestle with on a regular basis. I can see why you’d go with the cover and it definitely makes sense. Now, to the other question: does anyone really seek out these errors? Double covers, I understand. And maybe if you had ASM 300 but with a captain America cover or something, but that would a valuable book with an oddity added on. I don’t think an oddity by itself gets much attention, but I might be wrong? |
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Redmisty4me private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by ggovel I don't really see a serious collecting future for the two error books you note above, though they are slightly more compelling than missing pages. They're just too easy to create, and aren't remotely comparable to the genuine rarity & collectibility of errors that escape the notice of a multi-tiered government inspection process such as occurs at a mint or similar facility. Other than multiple covers, printing errors rarely enhance value in the comic book field. |
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 Collector
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Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Incidentally there is no confusion about the chicken and the egg, eggs existed for millenia before chickens evolved, so as birds evolved into chickens the egg production already existed within said species or type that would later become chickens. basically the archosaur family tree has relied on eggs since its division from other vertebrae forms. A more complicated version of the question might be which came first..the chicken or the chicken egg, which would likely resolve as there having to be a chicken that then laid the type of egg what would come to be associated with chickens...I am glad Ed's book was easier to sort out though. |
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 If the viagra is working you should be well over a 9.8.
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xkonk private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town That is tricky. Is a chicken egg an egg that contains a chicken or an egg that was laid by a chicken? Now we've turned our biological question into an etymological one. Also, now we know that CBCS judges a book by its cover  |
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Blair1999 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by xkonk I need more than 3 checks for this response. |
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 Not trying to be an ass since February 12, 2020.
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HulkSmash private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @ggovel there’s a niche buyer out there for this book. Is it worth the time and effort? Probably not. If you cast that line; that fish will eventually find its way to the hook. | ||
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