Beckett Grading Services...for comics?12763
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Steverogers11 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| #would take forever | ||
| Post 26 • IP flag post | ||
 The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Supertom If you were writing when Borock responded, then I apologize. I was going by message order. However, as mentioned by multiple folks the time taken to generate notes would be extensive. And while I do not know squat about how to run a grading company, my assumption is that Borock does. And if he is spitballing double the cost clearly your adding pictures to it comment was after the fact, how practical can that possibly be? I get it. As a consumer I want accurate notes to make judgment calls so I don't have to depend on my shitty ability to grade. However, time is money. And that's something you can't get around. If you are an expert grader, how long does it typically take to grade a book? If a book has extensive damage, how much time can you waste typing every fault? I have a tales of suspense 39 that you could spend literally 3 minutes writing defects down. By the time your done, how many other books could you have graded? My point is financially it doesn't add up. |
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| Post 27 • IP flag post | ||
 I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The question comes down to: as a comic collector, why would I pay for this more detailed service? Maybe there's a real valid reason why I would. If the answer to the above question is: Yes I would. Then the business needs to ask: Is there enough demand to warrant offering this service at the price it needs to be in order to make it a viable option? Maybe there's a demand for this out there. Market research would need to be conducted to truly find out.....but my anecodatal knowledge believes this is simply not worth pursuing. |
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| Post 28 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Bronte I agree there. For lower grade books I don’t think is feasible. I also don’t think many people who send in beat up books will make a strong argument that their 3.5 should have been a 4. And the value swing in lower grades isn’t anything like an 8.5 to a 9.0 or a 9.4 to a 9.6. This all stemmed from the example I shared about a friend who recently purchased a CGC 9.4 X-Men 129. It was a little over $300. When he got it in hand it had 5 very apparent color breaking spine ticks. So now not only is he disappointed that the book has a few visible flaws, he knows that his 9.4 is probably not really a 9.4. I have 8.5s with fewer flaws. This book that he was really excited to get now has this looming asterisks floating above it all because a grader at CGC maybe didn’t have their morning cup of coffee. Now if the book had subgrades and notes that stated the flaws he could have made that determination at the time of purchase. Anyway, I’m just asking for some transparency and some consistency. Maybe it’s not this detailed subgrade system but as it stands now grading is this mystical art form that we’re not allowed to question. And it drives my OCD up the wall. |
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| Post 29 • IP flag post | ||
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Supertom So I have to ask. Do you buy grader notes on all high dollar books before you buy? At what price point do you start? Edit Actually a better question. Did your buddy buy the notes before he bought the book? |
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| Post 30 • IP flag post | ||
 Thank you sir. May I have another?
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Siggy private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by sborock I forgot you guys do the checkmark, but yes the sticker just means the book looks better, which is what the OP was after. Perhaps I should have said busier version rather than "different" since it requires more, but essentially the idea is to designate it a better looking item. |
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| Post 31 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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kon_jelly private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Bronte This doesn't make sense to me. Whatever notes they are taking on the books they have to take now, correct? I mean it's not like they just glance over the book and assign a grade, they go over it, take note of the issues, and then assign a grade (which happens multiple times per book, btw). If what they saw on the book was crossed off on a form, or even just jotted down, I don't think the extra time would be more than a few seconds. I mean they're already doing something like this to get graders notes now. If the idea is to have "sub-grades" for different categories I could see it taking a bit extra time to come up with what those numbers are, but the notes on the condition are already done. We'd be talking, what, a couple extra minutes per book? Maybe on one that the graders are really weighing many issues a little longer? I think the additional *processing* of the notes would take extra time, sure, but that's an administrative process (and I really hope isn't something done by the graders). Most of the time we spend waiting for our books is the time they sit waiting to be graded, not once the grading is over. But sure let's say it adds an extra week just to buffer - I think it's an interesting enough idea that I'd bet plenty of people would try it out, depending on what it cost. |
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| Post 32 • IP flag post | ||
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @kon_jelly Read arguments made on other posts. If it still doesn't make sense. I'm not the one that can explain it to you. |
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| Post 33 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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kon_jelly private msg quote post Address this user | |
@Bronte Great discussion.  |
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| Post 34 • IP flag post | ||
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @kon_jelly Yes. And you can lead a horse to water... Edit. Ok ill bite. Try this experiment. Take a beat up comic and write everything wrong with it. With as much detail as you are expecting out of this new graders note. Now. Type everything. How long did it take? Compared to generalized graders notes you would normally get of one or 2 phrases. Or as author suggested, hire an intern to type notes. Assuming they can read the handwritten notes. Remember that time is money and that stack of books you are to grade before you go home is not getting smaller. |
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| Post 35 • IP flag post | ||
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Steverogers11 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Again it would take forever. Steve would have to hire so much more staff to keep TAT at a reasonable time frame. Otherwise they would b losing more business because it would take to long to write everything wrong with a book | ||
| Post 36 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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comixcited private msg quote post Address this user | |
| here is what I do for my listings on Ebay. it takes 5-10 min per comic and when multiplied by 100s or 1000s that would add up quick!! say it even took 3-5 min. that's still an extra hour for every 20 comics at best. This comics attributes listed below are graded on a scale of 1-10 GLOSS: 9+ INK/COLOR: 8-9 SPINE: 8 EDGES: 7 CORNERS: 6-7 PAGES: 7-8 cream/off-white OVERALL EYE APPEAL: 7-8 OTHER NOTES: some light folds on cover I have been collecting for over 15 years and have a good grasp of grading. I use the rules laid out in the Overstreet comic grading guide, here is an abbreviated sample: http://reviews.ebay.com/Overstreet-Grading-scale-How-to-for-comic-books?ugid=10000000005696333 I will do my best to point out any major flaws and post detailed pictures of all the comics I list. Grading is subjective. If I missed anything let me know and we can work something out. I will accept returns for a full refund. International shipping will not be free. price must be calculated at auction end. |
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| Post 37 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I can't imagine the headache this will cause grading companies if they included detailed notes with their grades. People bitch and complain now about a spine tick or two on a 9.4. Imagine if there were detailed notes with the number of spine ticks and other defects listed on this "report card" that differs from the submitter's opinion. I'm sure grading companies spend a lot of time having to deal with people challenging them on how their books graded. This would be a disaster for them if they implemented anything like this. |
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| Post 38 • IP flag post | ||
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I don't believe this....and I know you don't care that I don't believe this.
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GAC private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DE 100% agree!! |
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| Post 39 • IP flag post | ||
 I'll probably wake up constipated.
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Pre_Coder private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Grading a card takes just a fraction of time compared to grading an entire comic book page by page. Especially SA/GA key books. Especially high dollar key books where restoration is detected and then magnification/black light/low watt ultraviolet light is used page by page... Yeah, I can see how a card's TAT would be spot on. There is absolutely no comparison! But I csn see how a few extra key strokes can make a difference.... I had an ASM #1 graded by CBCS (blue label) and the notes/label stated... "Piece of tape inside cover". Okay,... what kind of tape, how large piece of tape, inside which cover, and located where. Pretty much leaves things up in the air. Correct notation should be... 1" strip archival tape inside back cover bottom center. A little extra typing can divulge a ton of info. |
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| Post 40 • IP flag post | ||
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Bronte No he did not. It was an eBay purchase. Pictures looked good and the price seemed fair so he jumped on it. I personally think it’s pretty shady to keep that kind of basic information behind a paywall. You could spend the $5-$15 for the notes and then chose not to buy it. Then you’re just out a few bucks. It’s like if your LCS charged you if you wanted to see something in the glass case. |
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| Post 41 • IP flag post | ||
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The apple sauce and pudding were the best part...
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Bronte private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Supertom Forgive my stupidity. But the logic escapes me. If he did not buy the graders notes, how does extended notes help? "Now if the book had subgrades and notes that stated the flaws he could have made that determination at the time of purchase" |
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| Post 42 • IP flag post | ||
 I'd like to say I still turned out alright, but that would be a lie.
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flanders private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Supertom It looks like the graders at CGC appear to have forgotten their morning cup of coffee for the last few years. You're making a case for subgrades based on the fact that CGC has been overgrading thousands of books in recent years? It seems that you should be making a case for more accurate grading given the current criteria involved, not introducing more grading criteria to further complicate things. I do like the idea of subgrades, but consumers can make these decisions themselves as to what comic in a specific grade presents better. I do also agree that the grader notes should be more specific as to the location of imperfections noted. |
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| Post 43 • IP flag post | ||
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @50AE_DE But that’s exactly what this would solve. The point of the report card is to clearly identify the defects on the books so that there’s no valid argument. There should be no “opinion” involved. If the grader notes 5 spine ticks you can’t argue that one doesn’t exist! There will always be yahoos who argue that their books are in perfect condition but we’re talking about physical evidence here. | ||
| Post 44 • IP flag post | ||
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Supertom So what happens if I get a book pressed and submitted and it comes back a 9.8 with no notes on the report card about any spine ticks but months, or years, later the spine tick starts to reappear. The notes would then be worthless since it won't match the physical evidence. |
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| Post 45 • IP flag post | ||
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Steverogers11 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Start up a grading company | ||
| Post 46 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Seems like Vault Grading may offer just what the OP is looking for. Detailed grader notes for about $55. | ||
| Post 47 • IP flag post | ||
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Steverogers11 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DEwell there u go |
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| Post 48 • IP flag post | ||
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Bronte because the subgrades are visible on the label. He could have seen that the spine had a lower score, then looked up the book and read the grader notes which would clearly say “book has 5 color breaking spine ticks”. This is assuming the grader notes remain free for the public to see as they are now. | ||
| Post 49 • IP flag post | ||
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @flanders that’s fair. But I don’t know how we could ask for more accurate grading if the current method of grading is still this nebulous “art form”. I don’t think the grading criteria really changes all that much. They’re reviewing the entire book regardless, the additional breakdown would just help clearly define how the book achieved its grade. If we started getting more detailed notes that would definitely be a step in the right direction. At least for CBCS. CGC will never do it. They even reduced their grading criteria down to vague one sentence descriptions like they invented some proprietary grading system that they must keep secret. I just like the idea of subgrades because then it’s right there on the label. |
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| Post 50 • IP flag post | ||
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Steverogers11 your name is quite fitting. Like the great leader, Captain America, you’ve truly led the charge in this discussion with all your in-depth analysis, thoughtful responses and witty banter. I don’t know where this conversation would have gone if not for your wisdom. | ||
| Post 51 • IP flag post | ||
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Supertom private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 50AE_DE The same thing that would happen if your house flooded and the book was water damaged. Or if the case cracked. The grade is void if damage occurs. However, from the responses in here it seems like nobody really cares if the 9.8 has a spine tick or two. As long as it’s a high number and I get it back real fast, who cares! |
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| Post 52 • IP flag post | ||
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I'd like to say I still turned out alright, but that would be a lie.
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flanders private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Supertom I agree there are problems with the method, in particular different standards for different eras and possibly different grading criteria based on the company. | ||
| Post 53 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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50AE_DE private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Supertom Not at all similar. Try using that argument with a seller that has a book labeled a 9.8 with a spine tick but produces a "report card" no comments. I doubt any seller would downgrade their books from what is printed on the label. |
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| Post 54 • IP flag post | ||
 Leftover Sundae Gnus
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CatmanAmerica private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Supertom This is just a matter of common sense. Extra information about a newly graded book ...fee based or not... won't inform you about the grading of earlier copies of the same book. Unless making side by side comparisons the grading notes provides a grading service's best assessment which should be sufficient in most cases to make an informed decision. Quote: Originally Posted by Supertom But a sub-grade wouldn't necessarily tell you which flaws were weighed more heavily at the time of grading because it would still be a subjective judgment call in each case. I don't totally disagree with your premise, just the practicality of assessing the best of two books ...when only one may have the additional screening... unless you have a crystal ball. . |
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