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Snyder "Justice League" to be Released in 202111971

Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatKomics
Sure...marvel hasn't been perfect...heaven forbid the whole premise of Black Panther is a bit stupid....but...by and large they get character development right...dont change the characters actions or motivations or even powers and abilities to suit plot points. Justice League was just the wrong movie at the wrong point in the development of a DC universe.

JL Bats finds WW and brings her back into action since WW I...and now we have a 1984 follow up??...inconsistent universe building....there 100% will be some BS plot tool to somehow make everyone in normal DC continuity forget about 1980's WW....wait for it

I disagree with your "wrong time" on JL.

Wonder Woman's 2nd prequel doesn't make sense. 100% agree on that one.
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
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Originally Posted by 00slim

Because the tone is all wrong.

Of course he needs emotion. But he shouldn’t be gloomy. It’s his overall portrayal that was off.

BvS & Man Of Steel are tonally similar. They should be a total contrast.


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Collector Jabberwookie private msg quote post Address this user
I think man of steel has aged better than BvS.

I think the thing people struggle with is the comparisons to the 1978 Superman.

In that movie, people were accepting of Superman, in awe of him and willing to follow his lead.

While Snyder missed opportunities in his movies, I think he was on the right track.

If an all powerful alien showed up on earth today, he’d be treated with a lot fear, suspicion and paranoia.

I think Jonathan Kent more or less states this when he’s basically telling Clark he should have let those kids die.

I think we want Christopher Reeves Superman, but that’s just not the world we live in.

And, just for the record, I seem to dislike most Snyder movies, but he’s also not the reverse Midas, either.

I’d like to check out his cut, but my expectations are not especially high.

I’d love to be surprised, though.
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Collector 00slim private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jabberwookie
I think man of steel has aged better than BvS.

I think the thing people struggle with is the comparisons to the 1978 Superman.

In that movie, people were accepting of Superman, in awe of him and willing to follow his lead.

While Snyder missed opportunities in his movies, I think he was on the right track.

If an all powerful alien showed up on earth today, he’d be treated with a lot fear, suspicion and paranoia.

I think Jonathan Kent more or less states this when he’s basically telling Clark he should have let those kids die.

I think we want Christopher Reeves Superman, but that’s just not the world we live in.

And, just for the record, I seem to dislike most Snyder movies, but he’s also not the reverse Midas, either.

I’d like to check out his cut, but my expectations are not especially high.

I’d love to be surprised, though.


Yes, it suffers from comparison. And I absolutely agree that the world at large would initially fear Superman.

It’s stuff like Pa Kent even suggesting he should have let kids die that does not ring true to the character.

He should be encouraging him to show the world his potential as well as our own. Letting Jonathan die the way he did was so wrong. Encouraging Superman to hide himself & be afraid was a disservice.

By the end of the movie, the world in general should be applauding him. Batman could still be suspicious of him after seeing the destruction Zod brought to earth. There’s still room for BvS with that adjustment.
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Collector Jabberwookie private msg quote post Address this user
@00slim

I agree with you on Pa Kent. That was one area that stuck out to me, and not in a good way.

But, him telling Clark that maybe he should have let them die, made sense to me.

I can see why it wouldn’t to you, though.

I just hope Cavill stays as Superman. I like him.
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COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00slim
And Snyder’s refusal to honor what the character is, at his core, is the problem.


I agree with you.

Synder doesn't understand what a parent who adopts a child attempts to instill into their son/daughter. Clark's parents in the comics portray the best actions of what parents of an adoptive child do. The Kents sought to find things to armor him, build him up, instill morals, and support him. Their actions and words reinforced the best of humanity and attempted to have him understand that he was a part of this world. On the other hand, Synder produces a Clark Kent who is a freak, an outsider, who is isolated from the world by his parents. Synder's Kents raise Clark to distrust humans. Not a good way to bring up a child who you know has powers beyond those of mortal men and will live among them.

To add insult to injury, Johnathan mentally traumatizing his all powerful alien son by not allowing him to save him and allowing that child to watch him die. Seriously, Clark's dad allows him to watch him die in a situation that 1) Clark knows he could have saved him, and 2) Clark will go over and over in his mind until he himself dies. Maybe that's why he doesn't lead Zod out of Metropolis during their fight and allows countless human casualties to occur by continuing the fight in the heart of the city. Synder set up a scenario in which humans are to be distrusted and Clark isn't one of us. Thus, humans are expendable except of Lois and Martha. Why? because the Synder selfish Superman could only protects those he loves. Human's are bad and he isn't one of them- remember. He needs to distrust them. Human's would be bugs to that Superman. In other words, he'd be slightly better than Zod, but just slightly.

I think that Synder cut the Aquaman part out of Man of Steel because someone pointed out that Clark wouldn't have felt like such an outsider if he had met Arthur. He would have known that other higher forms of life existed on earth besides humans. It would have lead Clark to become a character counter to the moody, oh woe is me, whiny Superman in the film.
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Collector moodswing private msg quote post Address this user
Didn't care for bvs, Mos or justice league but they are at least better than suicide squad. That movie was terrible.
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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
100% on bvs ( and s bit of JL ) cramming way too much..

I dont understand why bvs had doomsday paperclipped onto the back end of the story and then the death and return of superman crammed into the end of bvs and beginning of JL

Doomsday storyline was a fun read because the justice league was fully formed and doomsday just piled through them over and over ... also, superman was a trusted, respected and cherished hero to the people of the world by then too so his loss had much more impact.. in bvs the base 3 players of jla had just met and supes want trusted at all.

return of the supermen was one of my favorite childhood story arcs ( with much more interesting character development of cyborg in that and the doomsday hunter prey mini series)

and it was all glossed over in these awful movies - tied to the back of an already very long, scrambled and boring movie in bvs
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Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user

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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Doomsday/ and return of superman should have been phasr 3 and 4 JLA movies. Like infinity and end game

Return of superman at beginning of jla movie ( which is formation of the team ) just doesn't make sense at all hence why imo any new cut will still suck
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Collector KatKomics private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith
Doomsday/ and return of superman should have been phasr 3 and 4 JLA movies. Like infinity and end game

Return of superman at being of jla just doesn't make sense at all hence why imo any new cut will still suck


yep!! said it before DC just didn't build their universe correctly...sure you don't have to copy Marvel but basic story telling dictates a certain time line....

WW84 is out of sequence when in JL says she hasn't been active since WW I.

Maybe they should have had WW in WW I then WW 84.....however many Bat as you want (no need to kill his parents thousands of times like poor Pete!)...any number of Superman films....maybe then a BvS and lo and behold WW is there and it makes sense....everyone eventually gets along....maybe some other better characters get their own films (really don't like this Flash or Cyborg)...then everyone teams up for big baddie Doomsday...Supes is 'killed' buy your black bag books here!!!...a few more movies, even a team one or two, as the world and heroes deal with a world without Supes... then bring him back for ultimate baddie Darkseid.

You could have had movies where people care about the characters...a team up where half the team isn't introduced in the film (just stupid!), a death of Supes that has resonance, impact and consequence. Instead we get sh!t after sh!t after sh!t..high school CG effects, characters with wild swings in powers and abilities (member when WW took a head but from Supes and was like...yeah?? did you mess my hair?? or when she ran faster than bullets to deflect them - nope? neither did the writers!!!)

Seems like no one at DC even bothered to spitball a few paragraphs to figure some sort of semblance of an overall time line and how they wanted things to fit together or some sort of character building exercise - what drives them, what are their powers....maybe they overcome obstacles despite not having the right powers instead of just leveling them up when needed.

ahhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

It seems like I'm coming down hard on DC but that's because most of my collection is DC...in my opinion they have better characters and teams, stories as good as or better than Marvels...too bad we'll never see it in movies.
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Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
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Originally Posted by Jabberwookie
I think man of steel has aged better than BvS.


Man of Steel had Michael Shannon playing Zod with a great understanding of the character and his genetically bred motivations. Not sure how much I would have liked it without that performance. Also I must admit the scenes on Krypton at the beginning of the movie were some of the greatest visual SciFi I've ever seen on film.
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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Can you imagine a phase 1 of jla back stories movies and forming up .. followed by phase 2 of them kicking ass against some fun superhero fare in individual movies only to get wiped out by doomsday incl no more supes by jla2..


Then a phase 3 world without superman .. And finally a return of the supermen phase in dcu with individual movies ( big screen or streaming ) for all the wannabe alt supermen and then the full revelation in a combined jla against darkseid ..

Would have been amazing ! At least in my mind... ( plus I much prefer cyborg as evil supes )

But hey .. Snyder can do all of it in half of a 4 hour movie so power to him
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
A copycat of the popcorn MCU formula would have been boring and unoriginal. Worlds of DC was setup perfectly fine.

We didn't need to see Batman's origin for the 5th time. Wonder Woman's would have helped.

Again: Backstory and development for Aquaman, The Flash, and Cyborg are all originally part of the Snyder Cut.
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Collector Jabberwookie private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbaySeller
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jabberwookie
I think man of steel has aged better than BvS.


Man of Steel had Michael Shannon playing Zod with a great understanding of the character and his genetically bred motivations. Not sure how much I would have liked it without that performance. Also I must admit the scenes on Krypton at the beginning of the movie were some of the greatest visual SciFi I've ever seen on film.


I’d never put much thought into it, but I think he did make the movie for me.

Seems like I’ve seen everything he was in after MOS.

And, agreed. I think that’s what is so frustrating about the Snyder movies.

You’ll have something amazing, and then you’ll have a choice that makes you scratch your head.

As someone else said, DC has great teams and characters, so I’d love for them to be able to package all that into a series of movies.

We all win in the end.
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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by theCapraAegagrus
A copycat of the popcorn MCU formula would have been boring and unoriginal. Worlds of DC was setup perfectly fine.

We didn't need to see Batman's origin for the 5th time. Wonder Woman's would have helped.

Again: Backstory and development for Aquaman, The Flash, and Cyborg are all originally part of the Snyder Cut.
mcu just did what comics always have done.. build relatable accessible characters of multiple story arcs which allowed audiences to all relate when these characters all came together for giant set pieces ..

It was no master stroke, just the common sense approach no executives Hollywood thought would work as they weren't into comics themselves until mcu was finally given a chance to be more than a one off.

Far far better than trying to do it all in half a movie. That just makes a confusing , confounding unrelatable mess

I would also argue that if dc did a wave of a story arc like reign of the supermen it would be both totally awesome and nothing like what the mcu had offered us to date

Far better than taking such a great arc and distilling it so far back it just becomes a confused superman in a black suit fighting his friends to fit into 10 minutes of screen time
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Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Part of the problem was Marvel's success. They became the barometer...not necessarily in creative execution but box office $$. When WBs movies didn't do the same or more it was automatically considered a box office failure. JL underperformed, that's probably fair to say but BvS, WW, Aquaman all did well.
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
I think a lot of people are confused as to what role Snyder actually plays in Worlds of DC. It's kinda funny.
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Also, while the haters protest, Henry Cavill is in talks to reprise his role as Superman.

Man of Steel 2? Black Adam? Shazam 2? Justice League 2? Bring it on.
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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
If bvs was good and JL was also good, it could have been huge success ..

I was super super excited when first bvs trailer dropped... i enjoyed man of steel and was more than ready for the next installment... But then i saw a few not so good trailers and thought, hmmmm.. I'll wait ... then i watched it and was basically " wtf is this trash ? "
It sapped all desire for JL and it came out as expected , more trash.

And I don't think I was the only one who felt this way ...

Good movie = success ... bad movie =failure ..

Look at joker it got totally trashed when it came out but people quickly realised it was a really good movie and success followed.
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith
mcu just did what comics always have done.. build relatable accessible characters of multiple story arcs which allowed audiences to all relate when these characters all came together for giant set pieces ..

It was no master stroke, just the common sense approach no executives Hollywood thought would work as they weren't into comics themselves until mcu was finally given a chance to be more than a one off.

Far far better than trying to do it all in half a movie. That just makes a confusing , confounding unrelatable mess

I would also argue that if dc did a wave of a story arc like reign of the supermen it would be both totally awesome and nothing like what the mcu had offered us to date

Far better than taking such a great arc and distilling it so far back it just becomes a confused superman in a black suit fighting his friends to fit into 10 minutes of screen time

Worlds of DC is built to standalone. It isn't build to feed the Marvel fandom sheep.

If you call shoehorning 1 character whose backstory isn't well-known (to casual fans) into a 3-hour film "trying to do it in half a movie"? Then I can't help you. Everyone knows Batman's origins and Superman was fleshed-out 3 years prior. You can't speak to how well it works for the other 3 because the real movie hasn't even been released yet.

Batman v Superman was designed for fans of The Dark Knight Returns and Death of Superman. It works for those fans. It's original. If I wanted to see old comic stories completely rehashed I would just watch DC Animated stuff.
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Collector Wraith private msg quote post Address this user
Im a fan of dark knight returns and death of superman and those movies did neither any justice at all..

To the point where I didn't think the creative team even read the source material beyond a casual flick through

And id say is completely unoriginal superhero flick we used to get .. it played out just like spiderman 3 .. snippets of multiple cool story arcs and ideas that deserved their own space to breathe that instead were mashed together into one incoherent mess .
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Except that, y'know, it was original.

It was a coherent movie, too. Not sure how/why it confused you. Snyder Cut clearly laid out motivations and how they were both manipulated.
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
I'll just leave these here, for anyone interested in considering enjoyment from Worlds of DC, and consider challenging themselves or being open-minded:

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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user




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COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
If people wanted to see old comic stories rehashed by DC then maybe we’d get films that are good. Wonder Woman takes the tone and direction from what Perez did with the character in comics and mixes it with some of the original tone and hope found in Donner’s Superman film. The movie works because people want heroes that they can look up to and reflect what they have found in the comics of their youths. Jenkins gave us that. They don’t want a suicidal Batman, a moody, whinny Superman, or heroes that get twisted into Watchmenisk type characters. Why would a parent want to expose their child to that type of hero? That's why the MCU works and so far the DC film universe doesn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC



Why is the Predator in a DC film?
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
If people wanted to see old comic stories rehashed by DC then maybe we’d get films that are good. Wonder Woman takes the tone and direction from what Perez did with the character in comics and mixes it with some of the original tone and hope found in Donner’s Superman film. The movie works because people want heroes that they can look up to and reflect what they have found in the comics of their youths. Jenkins gave us that. They don’t want a suicidal Batman, a moody, whinny Superman, or heroes that get twisted into Watchmenisk type character. Why would a parent want to expose their child to that type of hero? That's why the MCU works and so far the DC film universe doesn't.

Wrong mentality.

TDKR is obviously for mature readers/audiences.

Serious and thought-provoking comic book movies are a breath of fresh air from the House of Mouse joke machine. I'm saying that as a fan of both companies and both cinematic universes.
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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Never heard of Uxas?
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COLLECTOR Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by theCapraAegagrus

Wrong mentality.

TDKR is obviously for mature readers/audiences.

Serious and thought-provoking comic book movies are a breath of fresh air from the House of Mouse joke machine. I'm saying that as a fan of both companies and both cinematic universes.


No, a viewpoint or opinion that differs from your own and is just as valid.

Thought provoking? ROFLMAO. I've yet to see that from the DCEU movie. Please share with us how Suicide Squad was thought provoking.


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Collector theCapraAegagrus private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
Quote:
Originally Posted by theCapraAegagrus

Wrong mentality.

TDKR is obviously for mature readers/audiences.

Serious and thought-provoking comic book movies are a breath of fresh air from the House of Mouse joke machine. I'm saying that as a fan of both companies and both cinematic universes.


No, a viewpoint or opinion that differs from your own and is just as valid.

Thought provoking? ROFLMAO. I've yet to see that from the DCEU movie.

A viewpoint entrenched in an incorrect mindset? That's wrong, bud.

You wanna make it Marvel vs DC because you can't be intellectually critical of Worlds of DC in a vacuum.

If you didn't have preconceptions about WODC, you may be able to turn your brain on when you press play.

Suicide Squad is an exception to the rule. You already knew that, which is why you edited in.
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