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THE THREAD THAT KILLED ALL CORONAVIRUS TALK.11811

Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
No I wasn't asking for a spirited debate, just seeing how others view it. For myself, I am hard pressed to understand how nurses, grocery workers, and bus drivers are daily risking their lives in some way that compares to the potential now to be exposed.
Thanks for offering your opinion Gana!...…………..I also find the wages music stars, and sports figures get is ludicrous
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Collector David_Kent private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks gana will look into what you said.
Post 102 IP   flag post
Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
Both sides of the aisle (so I guess it isn't political?) have discussed an essential worker pay bump as part of whatever next stimulus bill comes out. I personally would be for it.
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Moderator Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user
Since everyone here has been a great support to me while I've been dealing with my health issues that I decided I'd share this news with you all. The physical rehab facility/nursing home that I now live in, informed me late this afternoon that we have our first covid-19 resident. This person is segregated on a separate floor that is now dedicated to covid-19 patients. The staff are all taking extreme precautions with the residents. I've been encouraged to wear a mask when other people are in my room. They provide masks. I am getting some more masks from my exwife and I am ordering a neck gaiter from Walmart (along with the 4 Allegiance Arts comic books due out next week). I'm not extremely worried, but like they say, shit just got real.

To top it all off, the local paper, The St Cloud Times reported that the New York Times named the city I am in as the number 1 spot for the next outbreak to occur. I've watched the numbers grow this past week and it just exploded here. Most cases are in meat processing plants, but that is of little comfort.

Be careful everyone, you can bet I'm going to be careful!!!
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Collector Bronte private msg quote post Address this user
@Jesse_O

Not sure this place can survive without your steady hand. Please be safe and take care.
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Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
@Jesse_O can you get outta there and go home or stay with family in another city?

Easier said then done... I know... but screw that! I'd be trying my hardest to get the hell outta dodge.
Post 106 IP   flag post
Moderator Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user
@Bronte LOL!! I'm sure everything would be just fine, but thanks for the compliment.

@GanaSoth yeah, that's a big negatory Ghost Rider. It's just not feasible at this point in time.
Post 107 IP   flag post
Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
Well Jesse. This information here may save your life. As well as the rest of you forum members and or your family/friends lives.

We were lied to about what works and what don't work for Covid-19 patients. The so called Dr that did the study on Covid-19 being treated with hydroxychloroquine is a freaking EYE Doctor that studies diseases of the eye... Then other reports that's on Lame Steam Media go on to say that hydroxychloroquine causes heart attacks which isn't true. They have been using this medication for decades, even pregnant women with arthritis has used without heart issues or damage to their babies for decades... Fauci is a sell out... Period.

New study in Italy states that:
211 people that were undergoing prophylaxis with hydroxychloroquine were exposed to Covid-19 and none were infected."

Here are links to the italian research (might have to translate the page to English):
Italian Covid-19 Study.

Here is the first link:
This one posted yesterday.

The second link:
This one posted three days ago.

Political or not, this information could save your lives. Just overlook the propaganda/political words in the articles if it should happen to contain any.
Post 108 IP   flag post
Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
So guys. Be safe, read up on those site links above, and if it comes down to it; if you think you have it, tell them what drugs you want to use to treat it. It's your body, your choice.
Post 109 IP   flag post
Joined The Club Steverogers11 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GanaSoth
@Jabberwookie Sure. Believe it or not, I'm gonna paint one for @Darkseid_of_town (even though we go at it back & forth - I keep him young) we still can conduct ourselves as humans regardless of our beliefs in religion, politics, or facts/conspiracies.
No I don’t believe it. Say it’s not true





Send me a PM. We can discuss if I need to buy the miniature as well or you will ship it to me etc.





No way. If that can happen the world is gonna b alright
Post 110 IP   flag post
Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
@Steverogers11 Haha. It's happening.
Post 111 IP   flag post
Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
Here's an interesting thought to mull over:
Based on today's level of science and knowledge, how many times over the last 250 years would your country (wherever you are) have experienced this kind of shut-down? And would your country be better off today for having done it?
Post 112 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
https://thewebsters.us/2020/04/27/spanish-flu-in-san-diego/
Post 113 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steverogers11
Quote:
Originally Posted by GanaSoth
@Jabberwookie Sure. Believe it or not, I'm gonna paint one for @Darkseid_of_town (even though we go at it back & forth - I keep him young) we still can conduct ourselves as humans regardless of our beliefs in religion, politics, or facts/conspiracies.
No I don’t believe it. Say it’s not true





Send me a PM. We can discuss if I need to buy the miniature as well or you will ship it to me etc.





No way. If that can happen the world is gonna b alright
Amazing what two people can work out if other people dont try to make it worse....
Post 114 IP   flag post
Collector Nelsconey private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse_O
Since everyone here has been a great support to me while I've been dealing with my health issues that I decided I'd share this news with you all. The physical rehab facility/nursing home that I now live in, informed me late this afternoon that we have our first covid-19 resident. This person is segregated on a separate floor that is now dedicated to covid-19 patients. The staff are all taking extreme precautions with the residents. I've been encouraged to wear a mask when other people are in my room. They provide masks. I am getting some more masks from my exwife and I am ordering a neck gaiter from Walmart (along with the 4 Allegiance Arts comic books due out next week). I'm not extremely worried, but like they say, shit just got real.

To top it all off, the local paper, The St Cloud Times reported that the New York Times named the city I am in as the number 1 spot for the next outbreak to occur. I've watched the numbers grow this past week and it just exploded here. Most cases are in meat processing plants, but that is of little comfort.

Be careful everyone, you can bet I'm going to be careful!!!



St. Cloud

You are like 25-30 min from me. Small world
Post 115 IP   flag post
Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelsconey
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse_O
Since everyone here has been a great support to me while I've been dealing with my health issues that I decided I'd share this news with you all. The physical rehab facility/nursing home that I now live in, informed me late this afternoon that we have our first covid-19 resident. This person is segregated on a separate floor that is now dedicated to covid-19 patients. The staff are all taking extreme precautions with the residents. I've been encouraged to wear a mask when other people are in my room. They provide masks. I am getting some more masks from my exwife and I am ordering a neck gaiter from Walmart (along with the 4 Allegiance Arts comic books due out next week). I'm not extremely worried, but like they say, shit just got real.

To top it all off, the local paper, The St Cloud Times reported that the New York Times named the city I am in as the number 1 spot for the next outbreak to occur. I've watched the numbers grow this past week and it just exploded here. Most cases are in meat processing plants, but that is of little comfort.

Be careful everyone, you can bet I'm going to be careful!!!



St. Cloud

You are like 25-30 min from me. Small world


From my experiences dealing with traveling, normally 25-30 minutes (Google Maps time) turns into 1 to 2 hours real time, in NY.
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Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
They really need to release this to the public:
Test of Covid-19 against hydroxychloroquine.
Post 117 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
umm just to add, you notice the list of papers and reports down the side of the column..each one is a date and name where that report or study was published . To my eyes it appears that all that data was already known and public, as far as I can tell.
Post 118 IP   flag post
Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
@Darkseid_of_town yep. And it shows that hydroxychloroquine worked on SARS and Covid-19. Yet the news agencies aren't reporting on this.
Post 119 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
Well from what I can see, it shows nothing honestly.
I am guessing you seldom read science papers or understand much how they look or are organized. What you posted is something someone threw together, that appears to take single lines or comments from multiple works and places them in a single outline.
What is missing are the terms used to garner those results, what tests and how they were formed....There is no outline of what experiments were performed, etc.
They also demonstrate no effort to offer how the results were evaluated, by whom, or for that matter any of the negative results that would appear in any study , regardless how effective any treatment might be.
Anyone could take any single result they wished to support and cherry pick single quotes or lines from many studies to attempt to make the case...be it that the earth is flat or that Godzilla really exists.
Sadly what is missing is the opposing arguments, commentaries, responses, and their discussions finally.
Given as the it is, it does appear quite persuasive, but when you realize how science works, and how its results are shared, the outline you posted loses most of its.....zing.
If the news media were to share what you posted, they would likely be destroyed overnight from the response in the science community for offering up what amounts or appears to offer at best a cherry picked attempt to provide a narrative.
Perhaps tedsaid could weigh in as well being an accredited scientist with a degree, but that's what I can see from my reading at least.
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Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
By example here is a link to a rather simple science paper, so you can contrast how they appear...


https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rspb.2009.0691

Another more complex paper...

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/308156449_3D_Camouflage_in_an_Ornithischian_Dinosaur
Post 121 IP   flag post
Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
I never said they should take the exact copy I posted above and release that. I said "this information." As a starting point for self education.

The names and dates are listed in each summary that is listed. If you want a more completed summary/science paper, use the information in that link I shared as a starting point for investigation.

Example excerpt from the link I provided:

22 August 2005

CDC Special Pathogens Branch

MJ VIncet, E.Bergon, S. Benjannet, BR Erickson, Pierre Rollin, T.G. Ksiazek, NG Seidah,

ST Nichole. Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread. Virology Journal. (2005) 2: 69

Chloroquine has strong antiviral effects on SARS CoV infection of primate cells in tissue culture. These inhibitory effects are observed when cells are treated with the drug either before or after exposure to the virus, suggesting both prophylactic preventative and treatment use. The paper describes three mechanisms by which the drug might work and suggest it may have both a prophylactic and therapeutic role in Coronavirus infections.
Post 122 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
As I previously stated, each and every reference given in the piece is for an article, or paper previously published and readily availible for the public already.
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Collector GanaSoth private msg quote post Address this user
@Darkseid_of_town I know. But my point is, the MSM isn't telling anyone about it though. Neither is Fauci. I'm just trying to let you guys know in case you or a loved one gets the virus. You all now have a starting point to research and print off copies of the papers to show your doctors so you can get prescriptions if needed for
hydroxychloroquine/chloroquine. I just wanted to share that link with you all so you all have a staring point for researching and drawing your own conclusions.

Don't you all find it funny that they will prescribe it to patients that's on ventilators but not to people that just come down with the virus? By that time it's too late so of course it looks like it had no effect....

Yet the study states:
The HCQ-AZ combination, when started immediately after diagnosis, appears to be a safe and efficient treatment for COVID-19, with a mortality rate of 0.5%, in elderly patients. It avoids worsening and clears virus persistence and contagious infectivity in most cases.
Post 124 IP   flag post
Collector xkonk private msg quote post Address this user
Yeah, a lot of those articles are things like people giving their opinion at a conference, or tests of HCQ in a test tube or sample (in vitro) as opposed to a person. Not to say that it doesn't work or might not work, but from a scientific standpoint it needs more thorough testing.

Generally speaking, science as it gets released now isn't up for the speed at which things are happening. Trying to conduct a study, analyze it, write up a report, have it reviewed by other experts, and then published somewhere typically takes months to years and even then you'll have mistakes. Scientists trying to get COVID research out while the patients need critical care isn't going to help. There are already COVID papers that have been retracted, meaning there was a problem somewhere in the paper big enough to invalidate its conclusions. Even if they aren't retracted others have enough red flags that other researchers will call it out, like this HCQ one.

Again, not to say that it doesn't work. And if I'm on a ventilator trying not to die, I'd be happy to try things. Scientifically that's actually one of the problems; when you're in the middle of the mess and you're trying to keep people alive you're probably going to be using all sorts of stuff and so clean scientific control conditions and comparisons are very hard to get.
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Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard, Spock Tedsaid private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GanaSoth
@Darkseid_of_town I know. But my point is, the MSM isn't telling anyone about it though. Neither is Fauci. I'm just trying to let you guys know in case you or a loved one gets the virus. You all now have a starting point to research and print off copies of the papers to show your doctors so you can get prescriptions if needed for
hydroxychloroquine/chloroquine. I just wanted to share that link with you all so you all have a staring point for researching and drawing your own conclusions.

The French doctor has been criticized for poor research practices, including deciding who gets the treatment and who gets the placebo.

Here is one article in the "MSM" about it. I didn't bother to look for any more, but I will find them if you wish.

This document appears to be a series of notes on various research studies, at various stages. FYI, "in vitro" means in glass ... i.e., in test tubes and such, like "in vitro fertilization." So those are early studies in the lab. Then they test in animal models, and then they test in humans, but only for safety ... i.e., does X cause any damage, side effects, is it safe to take?

Then they start an actual, small-scale study to test efficacy. And THEN, if all that seems promising, they conduct a larger scale study with both an experimental and a control group.

It looks like these are notes on that progression. And now there look to be 1-2 papers that are "pre-print." That means they haven't gone through peer review yet. So there is nothing really to report, except what has happened in the news - particularly in France - where the possibility, and the protests over these drugs, have become the story. When the researchers have something positive to report, they will likely issue press releases, and that is when it will go mainstream.
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COLLECTOR drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
@Jesse_O Thanks for sharing Jesse.
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COLLECTOR drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town
If this one is political remove it and move on, but I have been wondering something myself about the programs and aid being given the american people in replacement of work wages.I belive the question is more economic related myself.
As I understand the loan forgiveness program created for small business and the unemployment thing being given for those out of work, it seems to suggest that while out of work , people would be paid for their time regardless. I dont question or care to comment one or the other way about that topic itself but...
What I am curious about is...take the bus driver, the fireman, the doctors, the grocery workers, all required to report to work each day and risk their actual lives , (not being dramatic) literally risking their lives, to see that things continue as they should. Not only are they required to continue working to get their wages, while everyone else theoretically gets paid, but they are being required to risk their own lives to earn while others are paid to sit and wait it out.
Do you think there is fair reason to suggest that essential workers should be paid a premium in the stimulus being provided based on that model? They aren't being allowed to sit at home, draw their wages and stay safe, and yet are working for the same wages as they would have been given anyways.
I think the 25,000 dollar idea that was floated earlier on is far too extravagant, but is their some merit to that system at a lesser cost perhaps?ANyone have a take there?


While I get where you are coming from this would lead us further down bad decision road.

This all stems from telling some people that they are not allowed to report to work or to tell some businesses that they must shutter their doors.

While a few happy workers are being paid slightly more to stay home than they would have made had they been allowed to continue working, most people getting government money, especially small businesses are getting far less than they would have gotten otherwise.

Many small business owners (local comic shops especially) are really feeling the pinch and may never reopen.

All of the workers deemed essential are being hailed as heroes in the news, on Facebook, and elsewhere. Many of these workers have gotten raises or earned overtime pay.

I will refrain from posting my own opinion but many would say that more government intervention or payouts would do more harm than good.
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COLLECTOR drchaos private msg quote post Address this user

Post 129 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkseid_of_town
If this one is political remove it and move on, but I have been wondering something myself about the programs and aid being given the american people in replacement of work wages.I belive the question is more economic related myself.
As I understand the loan forgiveness program created for small business and the unemployment thing being given for those out of work, it seems to suggest that while out of work , people would be paid for their time regardless. I dont question or care to comment one or the other way about that topic itself but...
What I am curious about is...take the bus driver, the fireman, the doctors, the grocery workers, all required to report to work each day and risk their actual lives , (not being dramatic) literally risking their lives, to see that things continue as they should. Not only are they required to continue working to get their wages, while everyone else theoretically gets paid, but they are being required to risk their own lives to earn while others are paid to sit and wait it out.
Do you think there is fair reason to suggest that essential workers should be paid a premium in the stimulus being provided based on that model? They aren't being allowed to sit at home, draw their wages and stay safe, and yet are working for the same wages as they would have been given anyways.
I think the 25,000 dollar idea that was floated earlier on is far too extravagant, but is their some merit to that system at a lesser cost perhaps?ANyone have a take there?


While I get where you are coming from this would lead us further down bad decision road.

This all stems from telling some people that they are not allowed to report to work or to tell some businesses that they must shutter their doors.

While a few happy workers are being paid slightly more to stay home than they would have made had they been allowed to continue working, most people getting government money, especially small businesses are getting far less than they would have gotten otherwise.

Many small business owners (local comic shops especially) are really feeling the pinch and may never reopen.

All of the workers deemed essential are being hailed as heroes in the news, on Facebook, and elsewhere. Many of these workers have gotten raises or earned overtime pay.

I will refrain from posting my own opinion but many would say that more government intervention or payouts would do more harm than good.
myself personnaly I dont think I know anyone who would have made more working, when you count the wages being compensated for, plus the stimulus gift from the government. Most that I know have profited from it.
Aside from that, the small business forgiveable loan program does not determine what wages people are paid, the business takes the loan, pays their payroll and utilities just as if they were still operating.
So the majority ARE being paid their full wages, plus the stimulus, and that is just so far in the equation.
Meantime they are safe at home, not working, and also not exposed to the virus while the Walmart worker, who is A) making far less, and B) exposed to the potential death factor.

"All of the workers deemed essential are being hailed as heroes in the news, on Facebook, and elsewhere. Many of these workers have gotten raises or earned overtime pay"

and the simple truth is some aren't, haven't and won't.
Meantime we keep burying them, at a frightening rate.

More government payouts and intervention might be a bad idea, but we are already crossing that river....so we either abandon the people who got us that far as they carry the burden or continue watching them drown while refusing anything further for them.Meantime everyone else is siting at home safe and being paid to boot....
The other factor I find astonishing here is if someone is not working and is determined to earn a wage...why not go to the local hospital or morgue and take a job with cleaning, disposal of the dead, or dozens of other places more hands might make a difference. Share the risk if you want paid...better yet, cancel their government compensation for sitting on their butts nice and safe, let them share the risk and earn their own wages too...since the essential workers have to...wouldnt that more closely match your suggestion and reduce government roles?
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