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Ebay Deals, Dreck and Goofiness10764

Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard, Spock Tedsaid private msg quote post Address this user
So, a week or two ago I bought one of those Marvel Comics #1000 D23 Expo covers. It's a great cover, very limited, and completely ridiculous, price-wise. So I decided to buy a couple, get them slabbed, and sell them. This cover just seems to keep going up in price.

I received a standard Priority Mail box that was pretty crushed in the middle. Well, no reason to worry yet ... let's see what's inside.

Inside was about 2-3 inches of bubble wrap - enough to make it a snug fit in the box. And inside that was a sandwich of two pieces of cardboard, with the comic (bagged and boarded) inside. I pulled it out and it looked great. Then I took it out of the plastic and saw a dent. Ug. Looks like it got dented after all when the box was caved in.

So, a lesson to us all ... all the bubble wrap in the world won't save you if the bubble wrap itself just bends the comic, due to a crushed box. And two thin pieces of cardboard isn't enough to stop that. Especially on a prestige format squarebound, that doesn't have any play in the spine.

Here are pics, of the book and the box. In the first one I angled it to catch the light where it is bent; for the second one I angled it to catch a shadow:
















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Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
I'm more convinced than ever that some people are motivated to purchase simply because you give them the power to negotiate price. On MCS I typically reduce my asking price about 5% every 30 days for books that aren't moving. A few times, after reaching my bottom price I've raised the price by 25-35% and activated the "make offer" option. In almost every case I sold the books (fairly quickly) for more than lowest price that I had previously offered.
Post 177 IP   flag post
Collector Huntergreene private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tedsaid
So, a week or two ago I bought one of those Marvel Comics #1000 D23 Expo covers. It's a great cover, very limited, and completely ridiculous, price-wise. So I decided to buy a couple, get them slabbed, and sell them. This cover just seems to keep going up in price.

I received a standard Priority Mail box that was pretty crushed in the middle. Well, no reason to worry yet ... let's see what's inside.

Inside was about 2-3 inches of bubble wrap - enough to make it a snug fit in the box. And inside that was a sandwich of two pieces of cardboard, with the comic (bagged and boarded) inside. I pulled it out and it looked great. Then I took it out of the plastic and saw a dent. Ug. Looks like it got dented after all when the box was caved in.

So, a lesson to us all ... all the bubble wrap in the world won't save you if the bubble wrap itself just bends the comic, due to a crushed box. And two thin pieces of cardboard isn't enough to stop that. Especially on a prestige format squarebound, that doesn't have any play in the spine.

Here are pics, of the book and the box. In the first one I angled it to catch the light where it is bent; for the second one I angled it to catch a shadow:


Nice share. Notice the grain of the cardboard is the same on both pieces. I wonder if having both pieces perpendicular to each other would have prevented this. After all the cardboard is bound to flex along that corrugation line.
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Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard, Spock Tedsaid private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huntergreene
Nice share. Notice the grain of the cardboard is the same on both pieces. I wonder if having both pieces perpendicular to each other would have prevented this. After all the cardboard is bound to flex along that corrugation line.

Certainly, he needed thicker, stronger cardboard. On something like this, I usually put the comic in a gemini mailer, and THEN wrap it in bubble wrap and put it in a priority mail box.

The seller did agree to refund half the purchase price. It's just a damn shame, because the part on the binding can't be pressed out, and it was perfect before he mailed it.
Post 179 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
eBay seller: comics_ink

sold me Worlds Finest 88 (Oct 2019).
sent to CBCS for encapsulation.
came back as Trimmed.
notified seller; he stated he doesn't check/doesn't know about Restoration/Trimming. he offered me $60 in store credit (50% of what I paid for the book).
I Declined store credit because he doesn't do/know about Restoration checks/Trimming so it's possible I'd receive another Restored/Trimmed book.
I did say I'd accept a $60 partial refund (not the ideal solution to me but better than nothing).
End of communication from comics_ink.

What do you guys think here? Am I wrong?

I never intentionally buy Restored/Trimmed books. Had I known this book was either of those things I would not have bought it.
Post 180 IP   flag post


Rock, Paper, Scissors, Lizard, Spock Tedsaid private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC
eBay seller: comics_ink

sold me Worlds Finest 88 (Oct 2019).
sent to CBCS for encapsulation.
came back as Trimmed.
notified seller; he stated he doesn't check/doesn't know about Restoration/Trimming. he offered me $60 in store credit (50% of what I paid for the book).
I Declined store credit because he doesn't do/know about Restoration checks/Trimming so it's possible I'd receive another Restored/Trimmed book.
I did say I'd accept a $60 partial refund (not the ideal solution to me but better than nothing).
End of communication from comics_ink.

What do you guys think here? Am I wrong?

I never intentionally buy Restored/Trimmed books. Had I known this book was either of those things I would not have bought it.

Trimming is hard to detect, unless you really know what to look for. Anyway, it sucks for both of you, buyer and seller. So I think he should accept the $60 refund offer ... it isn't his fault, but he's responsible for it. He could counter with a full refund to have the comic returned, which would also be fair, but then you'd lose what you paid for grading (and pressing, if you did that).

It's tough though, because you bought it seven months ago. I'd hate for that to happen to someone I sold a comic to, but seven months is a long time. Past when most companies would hold the seller responsible.

I'd say take what you can get. Trimmed comics are pretty rare, though, so unless the guy is doing the trimming, or he bought a trimmed lot, it would be unusual for another comic from him/her to be trimmed, also.
Post 181 IP   flag post
Collector Bronte private msg quote post Address this user
Dont take this the wrong way, but you seem to be a magnet for restored or modified books. While I can somewhat understand wanting a deal and risking buying a raw book, you are in effect taking a risk. In my opinion, I dont think it is reasonable to expect CGC / CBCS results on a raw book. You bought the book based on pictures presented.
If you had doubts, dont buy it. Ask the forums for opinions before buying it. Yes, it may suck to lose out, but to come back months after the fact, is to me unreasonable.

I think you have been fortunate that so many books worked out in your favor, but perhaps you should save your money and buy books that are already pregraded and checked. That way your expectations are met.
Post 182 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
@Bronte it may seem that way but what's happening is this. Since 2007 when I got back into collecting I've bought over 3000 raw books....the vast majority are SA and the vast remaining are BA with a few CA/moderns etc. making up the rest. My very first submission was April 2016 (to CBCS) and since 2016 I've been gradually ramping up my submission frequency. Between CBCS and CGC my slabbed collection is probably just under 300 slabs. Of these sub 300 I've had 5 returned as Restored/Trimmed...around 2%. Lately, the past 2 years, I've bought less and less because I'm slabbing more and more. Lately, when I do buy its usually (95% of the time) slabbed but obviously not 100% of the time. While I agree with you that buying slabbed removed the resto/trimmed concern, does that remove all responsibility from the seller who sold an undisclosed trimmed book? Part of the reason it takes a while to bring this to the seller is the TATs from the graders.

If the seller said the book was a 6.0 and CBCS came back as a grade of 4.5 (and this has happened to me more than 2% of the time), I would never bring this to a seller...grading is subjective...I totally get that...Restoration/Trimming, not subjective...difficult to detect? Maybe. But not subjective. Sellers should stand by this non-subjective error in my opinion.
Post 183 IP   flag post
Collector Bronte private msg quote post Address this user
All I am saying is that buying a raw book invites risk into the equation. That lower price paid is part of the risk of restoration. If you have difficulty in spotting restoration and you've bought thousands of books a person less knowledgeable as yourself might have a difficult time as well.

While grading introduces added time to the process, that isnt the sellers fault. People generally try and do the right thing. But perhaps you can lessen the mitigating factors by asking a few questions.


For example, do you ask the sellers what their policy on restoration is? Are they the original purchaser of the book?

I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I'm just trying to see it from both perspectives. If I was a casual seller and someone brought up a book sold quite a few months after the fact and posted me as a bad seller, I'd be slightly annoyed. Granted I only sell in graded books. So there generally is no questions.
Post 184 IP   flag post
DUD OR STUD Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user
I don't know if I could spot trimming. I would need to see examples in hand to be able to see it. The vast majority of the books I buy are raw, so I've been hit with the color touch bug before. Notably my X-Men #98, 99, and 101. So livid, and I can't find the ebay seller who sold them to me, but I was pissed when the 101 came back with color touch. Of all the books I've submitted, only three have come back restored. X-Men #15, 101, and Daredevil #158. In at least the case with the Daredevil book, the shop made it right and gave me the option of a store credit/refund for the full amount of grading and shipping fees + the cost of the book. If it isn't a regular comic seller, then I am much more cautious in the purchase process. If it is being sold as-is, buyer beware. Really it's buyer beware on everything. Like Stone Cold Steve Austin said "Don't trust anybody." For the record, I also throw a lot of cash at overseas sellers so I can get raw pence books. It's not so much that I want a TOS 52 raw, but I also understand the costs involved in a UK dealer sending books for slabbing can really hinder their ability to make money. Anyways, I don't think GAC is out of line in getting a partial refund. It's better than nothing, and maybe he can trade of sell the book to recoup a little more of the loss. It sucks but it happens. Trying to find that common ground to meet at can be the hardest part.

On to more ebay goofiness. I issued my first refund this past week. Buyer purchased a set of books, I sent them, and trying to be a mindful citizen, I used the drop box at the post office, and the books weren't scanned in to the system for 7 days. Then the route was all jacked up from there. Took about two-ish weeks for the books to arrive. Before the books were delivered, he opened up an item not received case. I had been in contact with him before this about being patient with the post office, and I even went to the local branch to see what was going on. I just did an immediate refund. Lo and behold, the books get delivered the next day. Go figure.
Post 185 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
I'm not taking comics_ink to task on this. In my opinion, undisclosed restoration and trimming is different than over grading a book. Even if detecting resto and trimming is difficult. I'm not asking the guy to reimburse me everything...I agree its buyer beware to an extent....like on subjective grading but not on resto/trimming. That's on the seller to know and disclose. To me it's the same as selling a car that you sold as completely operational but the AC is broken....you have to disclose that.
Post 186 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Studley_Dudley
I just did an immediate refund. Lo and behold, the books get delivered the next day. Go figure.


Hopefully he's paid you back?
Post 187 IP   flag post
Collector sportshort private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Studley_Dudley
I just did an immediate refund. Lo and behold, the books get delivered the next day. Go figure.


Hopefully he's paid you back?


fingers crossed
Post 188 IP   flag post
DUD OR STUD Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user
It was small amount, like $15. He did offer to pay me back, but I just let it go. I was more irritated that the claim was opened without reaching out to me first. I felt it wasn't hard to contact me since I was messaging him to tell him that I was working with the post office to track down the package. He left positive feedback, so I guess that's a win.
Post 189 IP   flag post
Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Studley_Dudley
I was more irritated that the claim was opened without reaching out to me first


I would be irritated also, but there may be another side to it. I don't know if this applies to your situation but when one of my purchases was significantly delayed I inadvertently opened a case just by inquiring about the delivery. I sent a question to buyer using the "where's my item" option and next thing I knew, a case had been opened. It wasn't what I was trying to do and it expired after 30 days without response from me. The item literally took about 60 days to get to me.
Post 190 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronte
I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I'm just trying to see it from both perspectives. If I was a casual seller and someone brought up a book sold quite a few months after the fact and posted me as a bad seller, I'd be slightly annoyed. Granted I only sell in graded books. So there generally is no questions.


He's a comics dealer, not a casual seller...what is the other perspective? He sold an undisclosed trimmed book, that's pretty much it. I don't think I'm posting him as a bad seller. I'm presenting the scenario as it ocurred. Ultimately the seller will respond to me or he won't. I believe the onus is on the seller to represent what hes selling accurately and if he makes a mistake, that's ok, we're all human, but that doesn't excuse him from correcting his mistake and we just chalk it up to buyer beware do we?
Post 191 IP   flag post
Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAC
I'm presenting the scenario as it ocurred. Ultimately the seller will respond to me or he won't. I believe the onus is on the seller to represent what hes selling accurately and if he makes a mistake, that's ok, we're all human, but that doesn't excuse him from correcting his mistake and we just chalk it up to buyer beware do we?


@GAC I would say that the lag time in getting a professional restoration check makes it a difficult and complex situation. I know it's frustrating but in the sellers defense, he didn't sell it with the caveat that it would have to pass a professional inspection at some unspecified date in the future. He probably would have charged more if that were the case. He sold it only with the caveat that it would pass your inspection upon receipt. He could reasonably argue that once you approved it the responsibility passed from him to you. Just as the responsibility passed from previous owner to him once he approved his own purchase of the book. On the other hand, we are being very generous to give the seller the benefit of the doubt about knowledge of restoration. If he does this professionally, I would say he should give a reasonable resolution, but he's not required to.
Post 192 IP   flag post
Collector Bronte private msg quote post Address this user
In my opinion. And mine alone. You purchased the book as a raw. You got a raw. You took a gamble and you lost. You dont go to the casino and say I want my money back. In my opinion, you took a risk. If you want a sure thing, buy a book graded by a professional. IF the guy is cool as it seems most of the people you deal with appear to be, that is awesome. However, I DO NOT believe you are entitled to anything AFTER the Ebay terms and conditions have been met.

You seem to place the seller as an expert and he owes you something. That's where I disagree. He owes you the book you bought as described in the description and the pictures. If he literally said, no restoration, then that would be the only thing that would sway my opinion that I can think of currently.

Let me ask you this. If the book was graded a 5.0, but when you got it graded, it was a 8.0 and worth 1.5 million due to some scarcity beyond imagination, can you honestly tell me you wouldnt be happy as a clam? I would also gamble money that you would not offer him a refund saying you severely underestimated price of book. You would chalk it up and say, that you gambled on the book and we negotiated on a price point. I walked out ahead. All is fair.

But that is the point. You took a risk. You won. In your dealing with this guy you took a risk you lost. The point is, that why it is a gamble to buy a raw. For the off chance you get a diamond in the rough.

As for your last question, do we chalk this up as a buyer beware? Quite simply. Yes. Do your due diligence. Ask the questions before buying. Ask for the additional photos. Ask for 2nd or 3rd opinions. There are enough resources to make a sound judgment call in the given amount of time. IF need be, pay CBCS their extra fee for their expedited service. Anything to make it within the given time frame.

And just so you know I get pissed off too. I bought a batman book with color touch. Found out about it too late. Pissed me off to no end. I learned from that lesson that do not buy a book from ANYONE without knowing the book has a possibility of it being restored. The risk /reward ratio has to be severely skewed for me to make that error again.
Post 193 IP   flag post
Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronte
He owes you the book you bought as described in the description and the pictures. If he literally said, no restoration, then that would be the only thing that would sway my opinion that I can think of currently.


@Bronte I would differ slightly on semantics. I think in the collectibles market an item with undisclosed restoration is generally considered to be different than an item without restoration. The problem is the time lag. Ebay's terms and conditions offer a limited time to dispute the item as "other than described". Which is understandable to avoid chaos, but to your other point...it's part of taking the good with the bad when we search for value in raw purchases.
My biggest disappointments with restoration were a Strange Tales 135 9.0, A Hulk 181 5.0 and an X-men #4 6.5. On the other hand, I once bought a Forever People #1 for $50 that graded 9.8 and sold for $1,800...among other big scores with raw books.
Post 194 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
@Bronte Clearly we disagree. Not holding sellers accountable on definitive defects fosters a breeding ground for deception. How does anyone know the seller wasn't aware the book was resto/trimmed and simply didn't disclose it? If you're a comics dealer you should know what you're selling and if something slips by you, you should make it right. This notion that "anything you purchase is a gamble" leaves everyone vulnerable to being taken. Grading is different because its subjective. If I got a book that was advertised as a 6.0 and it came back as a 4.0, I understand that's on me. I believe it's on me because I saw the book and assessed the grade myself and decided to buy. I would never go back to a seller based on difference in grade. But undisclosed resto/trimming is not that.

I do appreciate the opinions even when they're different than mine. Thanks for discussing it!
Post 195 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
@EbaySeller This is beyond eBays terms of conditions. Obviously I can not force the seller to do anything through eBay because of the time that has passed. But this is about a comics dealer standing behind the books he sells. If he chooses to do nothing, so be it. But I believe he should.
Post 196 IP   flag post
Collector Bronte private msg quote post Address this user
@GAC
I'm glad we can disagree without going down a rabbit hole.

@EbaySeller
Those were some hard losses. I'm glad you had at least one good puchase to offset some of the bitterness.
Post 197 IP   flag post
Collector GAC private msg quote post Address this user
@Bronte Cheers 🍻!!
Post 198 IP   flag post
DUD OR STUD Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbaySeller
Quote:
Originally Posted by Studley_Dudley
I was more irritated that the claim was opened without reaching out to me first


I would be irritated also, but there may be another side to it. I don't know if this applies to your situation but when one of my purchases was significantly delayed I inadvertently opened a case just by inquiring about the delivery. I sent a question to buyer using the "where's my item" option and next thing I knew, a case had been opened. It wasn't what I was trying to do and it expired after 30 days without response from me. The item literally took about 60 days to get to me.


It could be that it opens automatically if you select a certain option. I've never had to use it, so I really don't know. At the end of the day, the guy wasn't a jerk or anything and did want to make it right, so I chalked it up to a lesson learned that I should always stand in line at the post office no matter the value of the item being shipped.
Post 199 IP   flag post
DUD OR STUD Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user
Hilarity ensued today as a package from the UK was delivered to me today. It felt flimsy as hell when the mail lady handed it to me. It was a bubble mailer. That's fine I use those to ship. I open it and to my surprise, or more like my expectation, there was one flimsy piece of shit cardboard. The kicker was when I flipped over the one piece, and stapled, yes stapled, was a f***ing Cheerio box to the cardboard. Comic free to move around inside. Comic was bagged and boarded but not fastened down in any stretch. I know damn well it doesn't cost shit to ship from the UK to the US, so there was no reason to not at least use two sheets of cardboard. And good cardboard sheets don't cost much. The comic still looked like it was ok. Maybe I just expect too much.





Post 200 IP   flag post
Collector HeinzDad private msg quote post Address this user
@Studley_Dudley, I received the first book I've ever ordered from across the pond this week. It was packed the same way. It was plastered with stamps and was packed so light as if they just left it in a corner mail box.
Post 201 IP   flag post
DUD OR STUD Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user
@HeinzDad normally I don't have an issue with it. I tried a different seller this time so shame on me for not checking first. Thankfully 30th Century Comics is opening up for mail order in a day or two so that helps me out immensely.
Post 202 IP   flag post
Collector EbaySeller private msg quote post Address this user
What am I looking at here? The discription has no mention of the odd visual.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Eternals-1-Origin-1st-app-Eternals-MARVEL-Comics/233604729274?hash=item3663ed49ba:g:V2AAAOSwsi5e0vCg
Post 203 IP   flag post
Collector Darkseid_of_town private msg quote post Address this user
guess watching the trimming debate I cant say I saw the images of the book that was offered before purchase, but if the seller gave nice sharp clear scans, then I think holding him responsible is a double standard actually , provided he in good faith was unaware of the trimming.
The argument seems to be as a seller he should know and be aware if he has books that are trimmed, but a buyer would somehow be exempt from practicing necessary prudence and checking the scans for such as well?
I seldom buy raw books except from the forum here, or MCS ...but if I were to go for anything very expensive, I would ask for high fidelity scans of the book which I could compare with other copies and check for color touch, trimming, and so forth.
I think if you are buying comics that are not graded nor slabbed, you bear the burden equally to your seller to verify and examine said book and make sure it isn't altered...trimming can be spotted easily provided its the entire book...
Again I did not see the scans nor description myself, so tough to say here but still...
Post 204 IP   flag post
Collector brysb private msg quote post Address this user
Don't you just love it when an eBay seller lists those big words like 9.6?? So I just bought a 5 issue lot of Alpha Flight #1 (1983) listed as 9.6 for $41, good deal, right? NOT! All 5 issues had stress marks on spine & IMO would grade them around a 9.0/9.2. So...REFUND!!!

Another eBay seller just last week sent me a whole box of goodies in NM...& they were, until he shipped them in a box that was too tight fitting and no room for proper packing materials, so...all had dented corners! So sad because I wanted these so bad, the price was right and they were perfection before improper shipping. Again...REFUND!!!

And then a couple of days ago another eBay seller sent me 5 comics listed as NM for $30, but had way too many imperfections to even name! So again, REFUND!!!

This seems to be the month for me to return everything to eBay sellers. I have one more eBay package in transit, fingers crossed here!

My advise...ONLY buy from an eBay seller if clear front and back picture of comic are provided. Sadly, even then that can be deceptive as some doctor up the images. View positive feedback as well, but then again, doesn't always mean anything. The thing about negative feedback is that the Seller & Buyer do not want any, so... even if the buyer has a bad experience, as long as the seller refunds/accepts returns you most likely will not see a negative comment posted. I think some of these sellers thrive on some buyers sucking it up and just accepting the crap that they send out, hence leaving positive feedback just to keep the peace.

Some of the WORST eBay experiences I have had are those with 100% positive feedback!! So, YEAH!
Post 205 IP   flag post
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