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Bye CBCS! Never even got to submit a book!4285

Collector Grayspeedster private msg quote post Address this user
From banning board members to lack of response on the magnitude of security issues, I've had enough.

I'll take a break from CBCS site for a while to reevaluate things. Maybe one of the companies will make a break through, maybe not. Either way, you've alienated me and I wasn't even a paying customer yet!
Post 1 • IP   flag post
Collector DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
Anyone who would remotely care is right now trying to keep their ass from being blown away by hurricane Irma. So, super classy on your part.


Post 2 • IP   flag post
I'M BRINGING SEXY BACK CFP_Comics private msg quote post Address this user
Who lost in this one?
Post 3 • IP   flag post
Collector 00slim private msg quote post Address this user
Look, I'll admit I'm on the fence at the moment. But I like CBCS. I have many more of their slabs than CGC. But the security issues brought up recently scare me a bit.

That said, I'm waiting. I'm waiting for them to address the issue. I'm waiting to see if they'll need support in the wake of this storm.

But most of all? I'm waiting to see if they are the stand up company I've come to believe them to be. I think with time, they'll prove to be exactly that. At least, I hope so.
Post 4 • IP   flag post
Collector Rafel private msg quote post Address this user
What security issues? Are our comic books safe or is it our personal information that's in danger>
Post 5 • IP   flag post
Collector 00slim private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafel
What security issues? Are our comic books safe or is it our personal information that's in danger>


The heat seals on the slabs have been questioned lately due to a case swap video on YouTube.
Post 6 • IP   flag post
Collector Rafel private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00slim
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafel
What security issues? Are our comic books safe or is it our personal information that's in danger>


The heat seals on the slabs have been questioned lately due to a case swap video on YouTube.


00slim, Thank you very much.
Post 7 • IP   flag post
still waiting drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
I expect to see Steve Borock at the upcoming shows in Baltimore and New York. I would rather get the facts from him than cry that the sky is falling.

Not too long ago CBCS put a fair amount of time and effort into redesigning the format of their labels. To me that behavior does not seem consistent with anyone that would simply ignore issues related to the security if their cases.
Post 8 • IP   flag post
Collector 00slim private msg quote post Address this user
@drchaos Precisely.
Post 9 • IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
@Grayspeedster made a decision based on how he saw other customers were being dealt with, free market at its best. Thanks for sharing.
Post 10 • IP   flag post
Collector BronzeAgeBaby private msg quote post Address this user
LOL because CGC cases are completely

... can't even finish that with a straight face.
Post 11 • IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
@BronzeAgeBaby The quality of the competitor's case isn't the deciding factor, read his post.
Post 12 • IP   flag post
Collector OrbitCityComics private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by BronzeAgeBaby
LOL because CGC cases are completely

... can't even finish that with a straight face.


I agree. I watched two videos on YouTube the other day showing CGC cases being compromised. One was a label swap, the second was a book swap.
Post 13 • IP   flag post
Collector BronzeAgeBaby private msg quote post Address this user
@KingNampa ... the "security issue" was brought up, was it not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrbitCityComics
Quote:
Originally Posted by BronzeAgeBaby
LOL because CGC cases are completely

... can't even finish that with a straight face.


I agree. I watched two videos on YouTube the other day showing CGC cases being compromised. One was a label swap, the second was a book swap.


^ DING DING DING
Post 14 • IP   flag post
Witnessed cigs dielinfinite private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
I expect to see Steve Borock at the upcoming shows in Baltimore and New York. I would rather get the facts from him than cry that the sky is falling.

Not too long ago CBCS put a fair amount of time and effort into redesigning the format of their labels. To me that behavior does not seem consistent with anyone that would simply ignore issues related to the security if their cases.


And that issue took six months to resolve without having been indirectly affected by one hurricane and taking a direct hit from another less than a week later. People cried about the sky falling for that issue as well.
Post 15 • IP   flag post
Collector Hcanes private msg quote post Address this user
I think compared to the guys across the street, CBCS has spoiled us with their customer service and transparency. That is why we are seeing the entitlement come out. These issues take time to assess and cannot simply be resolved as quickly as we would all like.
Post 16 • IP   flag post
Collector 00slim private msg quote post Address this user
Hence, the waiting.
Post 17 • IP   flag post
Qualified Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
This thread is an interesting statement about current events.
Post 18 • IP   flag post
Collector Drogio private msg quote post Address this user
I'm still putting cbcs slabs over cgc on my eBay watch lists...mostly because I know cbcs grading is slightly more consistent and I might get a deal because of their security issue and general lack of knowledge/acceptance on the general slab buying public...but I am making sure that sellers offer returns. One of the best things cbcs still offers is the grading notes for free...that puts my mind at ease that if I examine a book I should be able to quickly authenticate it based on the notes alone.
Post 19 • IP   flag post
still waiting drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
@Drogio Why should an eBay buyer accept returns on slabbed books?
Post 20 • IP   flag post
Collector OrbitCityComics private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
@Drogio Why should an eBay buyer accept returns on slabbed books?


There's many caveats to such a question.

Is the case cracked?

Was it tampered with?

Etc etc ...
Post 21 • IP   flag post
still waiting drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by OrbitCityComics
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
@Drogio Why should an eBay buyer accept returns on slabbed books?


There's many caveats to such a question.

Is the case cracked?

Was it tampered with?

Etc etc ...


Cracked case or tampered with gets you protection from Ebay under an item not as described claim. A good seller will work with you on a cracked case even if their policy is not to accept returns. If they ship USPS priority mail, the post office is liable anyway and the seller can file a claim and pass the proceeds on to you.

There is no reason a seller should have returns in their policy. If they did, you would be amazed how many slabs would be returned by buyers who simply changed their minds or found a lower price.
Post 22 • IP   flag post
Very studly Studley_Dudley private msg quote post Address this user
@Grayspeedster Later, bro. Take care.
Post 23 • IP   flag post
Collector Drogio private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
Quote:
Originally Posted by OrbitCityComics
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
@Drogio Why should an eBay buyer accept returns on slabbed books?


There's many caveats to such a question.

Is the case cracked?

Was it tampered with?

Etc etc ...


Cracked case or tampered with gets you protection from Ebay under an item not as described claim. A good seller will work with you on a cracked case even if their policy is not to accept returns. If they ship USPS priority mail, the post office is liable anyway and the seller can file a claim and pass the proceeds on to you.

There is no reason a seller should have returns in their policy. If they did, you would be amazed how many slabs would be returned by buyers who simply changed their minds or found a lower price.


I hear what you are saying...but I'd rather not take a chance on an expensive book as being tampered with and leaving it up to eBay to decide. Some people are just jerks and will fight you every step...id rather have a bit of insurance to know they are open to returns.

Speaking of which, if you go the route of a seller not accepting returns, then you'd better pay for insurance. I've had slabs damaged in the mail because of poor packaging by the seller...and the slab was so damaged it looks like tampering...so not only do I need a new slab i need to go through the risk of receivi a lower grade. The seller "made me" send in the claim because he "did not accept returns", despite it was his own poor packing skills...the reason I quoted "made me" is because I gave up as it wasn't an expensive book and was able to at least confirm it was not tampered with. I also won the USPS claim easily.

I have not sent in the book for a regrade, and I believe there is a good chance it will drop slightly. I'm hoping I can talk to someone in person at a convention and see what I should do.
Post 24 • IP   flag post
Collector BigRedOne1944 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos

"There is no reason a seller should have returns in their policy. If they did, you would be amazed how many slabs would be returned by buyers who simply changed their minds or found a lower price."


1000% DISAGREE, There is NO Reason a seller shouldn't have a Return Policy.

#1 Any and All respectable Ebay Sellers offer a return policy(most No questions asked)

#2 In order to gain Ebay's "Top Rated Seller" Status and the 20% Fee discount, a return Policy is mandatory.

#3 Ebay seller's who put up listings stating "NO RETURNS" are just plain stupid. Regardless of saying that, buyers can return, and you will accept that return.
Ebay WILL side with the Buyer and his right to return 99.99 % of the time and there is absolutely nothing you as a seller can do about it.

#4 Its just good business practice and builds consumer confidence in your brand. Not to mention establishing yourself as a respectable Seller that buyers will come to trust.

#5 I usually won't even do business with sellers who list "NO RETURNS" It just makes them look petty and untrust worthy.

#6 Ive sold 1000's of Card and Comics on Ebay and can only remember one return I had on a Card. And you know what? The Guy was right.... It was my bad on the card grade. Ive since made multiple deals with this same buyer over the years.

#7 While I personally have not experienced people abusing return policies. It is easy enough to block anybody that does abuse the policy.
Post 25 • IP   flag post
Collector 00slim private msg quote post Address this user
I'm with @drchaos on this one. I stopped accepting returns when I had someone tell me their kid simply didn't like the vintage SNES game they bought from me.

That is not a valid reason for a return, but since, at the time, I accepted returns I was obligated to oblige her. That was the last straw for me as a seller.

Yes, I could probably make more sales if I clicked that little box, but it isn't worth the headache.

Of course, if someone has an actual issue, I'll work with them. But by saying I don't accept returns, it has cut way way down on the shenanigans.
Post 26 • IP   flag post
Collector poka private msg quote post Address this user
Top Rated seller status is not what is used to be. For once the fee discount is 10% (lowered from 20% earlier this year). At the same time the fees got hiked for all sellers with a shop. Even as a top rated seller - you can choose which item you would offer return on. Just that if you choose not to offer return that listing will not show top rated seller.

Finally - reasons for not offer returns on slabs and preorders:

Slabs: Buyer knows what he get. If there is an issue with the slab - doesn't really matter whether one offer return on not

Preorders: should be fair to both buyer and seller. Not fair if a buyer can return a preorder just because the price decreased. But hey there is a way around everything - but will keep those to myself
Post 27 • IP   flag post
still waiting drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
@BigRedOne1944 Once again I will say that I 100% disagree with you. While I am sure that there are shady sellers on Ebay (especially since I have dealt with them) there are far more shady and simply careless Ebay buyers.

Buyers are 100% protected against shady sellers and 99% protected from honest sellers by Ebay. That no returns policy (and even better the blocked bidder list) is the only place where I as a seller get any protection from frivolous buyers. Once you pay for the book and accept shipment from the post office (after I have paid USPS hanseomely) the slabbed book is yours and can not be returned.

Sometimes despite my best efforts to double box the slab with plenty of bubble wrap the book will arrive with a cracked case. In those cases I file the claim with the post office and work with the buyer to get the full $50 from USPS and pass it along to the buyer for their trouble to get the case re-slabbed. I also educate buyers that do not know how to re-slab their books.

Some day soon I will start selling raw books and trade paperbacks where I will have to accept returns on those items. If anyone needs to be worried about who is reputable it is me.
Post 28 • IP   flag post
Collector Instant_Subtitles private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00slim
Look, I'll admit I'm on the fence at the moment. But I like CBCS. I have many more of their slabs than CGC. But the security issues brought up recently scare me a bit.


I know how you feel. I am reluctant to submit anything to PGX because they promote the durability of their own slabs, but not once mention the longevity of their wells. Plus, I do not like their labels. And with CGC, three of the four issues I did purchase on eBay had heavy signs of QC issues. Plus, there are similar videos that include CGC label swaps.

But despite that, our only options are to either have us boycott the sales of slabbed comics or find a way to combat this while they find a better solution. I think the former is easier because it gives us a "buyer beware" topic, as well another to help new slab collectors find honest sellers that might also not be members here. Simple stuff like that, and none of the mods "Nigel-ing the nadabigs".
Post 29 • IP   flag post
Collector BigRedOne1944 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00slim
I'm with @drchaos on this one. I stopped accepting returns when I had someone tell me their kid simply didn't like the vintage SNES game they bought from me.

That is not a valid reason for a return, but since, at the time, I accepted returns I was obligated to oblige her. That was the last straw for me as a seller.

Yes, I could probably make more sales if I clicked that little box, but it isn't worth the headache.

Of course, if someone has an actual issue, I'll work with them. But by saying I don't accept returns, it has cut way way down on the shenanigans.



I don't think you guys are getting the point

It doesn't matter weather you click "That little box" or not.

If your selling on Ebay YOU WILL accept returns no matter what. You simply do not have a choice.

If a buyer opens a claim and request a return Ebay WILL side with the buyer 99.9% of the time, and you will accept the return. Its as simple as that. Your only recourse as a Seller is to block the buyer from future purchases.

In over ten years on Ebay Ive never had a returned book and only the one card I mentioned. I think I'll stay with my return policy.
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