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Thoughts on label notes for this book17601

Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill. HexView private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by SGT_Comics
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Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
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Originally Posted by robertofredrico
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Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
I asked if a signature is on page 16, is it on 31 or 32?
Still no answer.



If a signature is on page 16, then it is on page 16.

See, I used to know that.
But what I learned is sometimes page 16 is page 16, and sometimes page 16 isn't page 16.


Upon reflection, it only makes sense for them to mean the 16th physical page, because otherwise it would have to say a piece had been cut from pages 31/32.
And regular comics from that era had less than 30 story pages 👍
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It was a one trick pony show but always hilarious. GAC private msg quote post Address this user
The confusion comes down to the definition of the word "page". It seems to the industry it means one thing and to the layman it means another thing.

They just need to get on the same....page.
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would be nice to have a snugger fit. Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by SGT_Comics
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertofredrico
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
I asked if a signature is on page 16, is it on 31 or 32?
Still no answer.



If a signature is on page 16, then it is on page 16.

See, I used to know that.
But what I learned is sometimes page 16 is page 16, and sometimes page 16 isn't page 16.


Upon reflection, it only makes sense for them to mean the 16th physical page, because otherwise it would have to say a piece had been cut from pages 31/32.

Are you saying that's too many characters for them to type or too difficult for them to understand?
A piece was in fact cut from pages 31/32.

It seems like that would inform anyone, including newbies, as to what's going on inside the book.

Anyway, all this was unimportant, as I tried to say in the original post, but you would think grading companies would be on the same page as the publishers with this. There are reasons there is a little number printed at the bottom of each page. Everyone knows Wolverine shows up on pg 32. No one believes he shows up on pg 16. Take a poll.

Wrap #8
Leaf #16
Page #31/32

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Hello, my name is Stu and I'm a shill. HexView private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Quote:
Originally Posted by SGT_Comics
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertofredrico
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
I asked if a signature is on page 16, is it on 31 or 32?
Still no answer.



If a signature is on page 16, then it is on page 16.

See, I used to know that.
But what I learned is sometimes page 16 is page 16, and sometimes page 16 isn't page 16.


Upon reflection, it only makes sense for them to mean the 16th physical page, because otherwise it would have to say a piece had been cut from pages 31/32.

Are you saying that's too many characters for them to type or too difficult for them to understand?
A piece was in fact cut from pages 31/32.

It seems like that would inform anyone, including newbies, as to what's going on inside the book.

Anyway, all this was unimportant, as I tried to say in the original post, but you would think grading companies would be on the same page as the publishers with this. There are reasons there is a little number printed at the bottom of each page.

Only the story pages are numbered. The ad pages are not numbered. Below is JLA 6, with page 22, 2 ads, then page 23.




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Quote:
Originally Posted by HexView

Only the story pages are numbered.

Exactly
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Collector SGT_Comics private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
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Originally Posted by SGT_Comics
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Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertofredrico
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
I asked if a signature is on page 16, is it on 31 or 32?
Still no answer.



If a signature is on page 16, then it is on page 16.

See, I used to know that.
But what I learned is sometimes page 16 is page 16, and sometimes page 16 isn't page 16.


Upon reflection, it only makes sense for them to mean the 16th physical page, because otherwise it would have to say a piece had been cut from pages 31/32.

Are you saying that's too many characters for them to type or too difficult for them to understand?
A piece was in fact cut from pages 31/32.

It seems like that would inform anyone, including newbies, as to what's going on inside the book.

Anyway, all this was unimportant, as I tried to say in the original post, but you would think grading companies would be on the same page as the publishers with this. There are reasons there is a little number printed at the bottom of each page. Everyone knows Wolverine shows up on pg 32. No one believes he shows up on pg 16. Take a poll.

Wrap #8
Leaf #16
Page #31/32



No, I'm not saying either of those things. I'm saying that a piece being cut out would affect both sides of a sheet of paper, so if they say a piece is cut out of only one page, then they must be referring to the physical piece of paper as the page, not what's printed on one surface of that paper.

I don't agree that this is the most intuitive way to describe it, but it is correct, especially considering, as @HexView pointed out, the marked page numbering can be inconsistent across publishers and eras. What if someone cut out one of those letters in the JLA Mail Room, which was printed with page 22, an ad page, the letters page, and page 23? Using the printed numbers is unreliable, but not using the printed numbers is counterintuitive. Maybe the term "leaf" would be better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Everyone knows Wolverine shows up on pg 32. No one believes he shows up on pg 16. Take a poll.

What "everyone knows" is immaterial, as it only goes to further what has already been established: the word "page" can have two meanings and one has to consider the full context to understand it. The "appeal to the people," or "argumentum ad populum," is a logical fallacy and cannot prove correct or incorrect based on the number of people who think one way or the other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Ignore the fact that they got the page number incorrect (shocker)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigur_Ros
Anyway, all this was unimportant, as I tried to say in the original post, but you would think grading companies would be on the same page as the publishers with this.

It isn't unimportant, as it's presented as fact in your premise as a way to bias the argument against CGC's label notes. We've established that CBCS would use the same terminology, "large piece cut out," so the only point still in contention is "they got the page number incorrect," to which several people have suggested the page number is not incorrect, just the common understanding of what a page is.
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would be nice to have a snugger fit. Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by SGT_Comics
We've established that CBCS would use the same terminology, "large piece cut out,"

I edited out everything that was covered 4 days ago, but thanks.
As for the above, I wasn't asking what CBCS would do. They do whatever CGC does. I was asking for thoughts on how specific notes should be when it affects the key portion of important keys.
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If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
For assembly line grading, and that is what any grading company does, processes have to be streamlined and standardized. That's why you get "large piece cut out" instead of "Wolverine character meticulously removed from lower right hand corner of page 16 with an exacto knife."
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would be nice to have a snugger fit. Sigur_Ros private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
For assembly line grading, and that is what any grading company does, processes have to be streamlined and standardized. That's why you get "large piece cut out" instead of "Wolverine character meticulously removed from lower right hand corner of page 16 with an exacto knife."

Right. I was saying earlier in the thread that I wasn't thinking about that. And the time it would take to he more specific than they are. I would bet it's just pull downs and they click one of like 5 or 10 pre-typed options. Same for grader's notes, I guess.
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If I could, I would. I swear. DrWatson private msg quote post Address this user
Plus, we all know how comic collectors can be, right? I can see Collector A saying, "Collector B received a full sentence on the label about who, where, how, and why their piece was removed from their book. Why did I only receive 'large piece cut out' on my label? I'm sending my book back for a new label and (the cgc/CBCS) should change it at their expense and pay shipping both ways. This is so unfair and unprofessional."
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Collector CatCovers private msg quote post Address this user
@DrWatson Painfully accurate.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
Plus, we all know how comic collectors can be, right? I can see Collector A saying, "Collector B received a full sentence on the label about who, where, how, and why their piece was removed from their book. Why did I only receive 'large piece cut out' on my label? I'm sending my book back for a new label and (the cgc/CBCS) should change it at their expense and pay shipping both ways. This is so unfair and unprofessional."


Hit the nail right on the head.
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Collector Byrdibyrd private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWatson
Plus, we all know how comic collectors can be, right? I can see Collector A saying, "Collector B received a full sentence on the label about who, where, how, and why their piece was removed from their book. Why did I only receive 'large piece cut out' on my label? I'm sending my book back for a new label and (the cgc/CBCS) should change it at their expense and pay shipping both ways. This is so unfair and unprofessional."

"Mommy and Daddy like you best! It's not FA-A-A-A-AIR!!!"

Oh yeah, that is definitely A Thing. Wanna know why labels can be so generic sometimes? This is it.
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Originally Posted by Byrdibyrd
Oh yeah, that is definitely A Thing. Wanna know why labels can be so generic sometimes? This is it.


My opinion would also be that the label should be short and sweet while detail goes in the graders notes.
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