Not a CBCS member yet? Join now »
CBCS Comics
Not a CBCS member yet? Join now »
Collector* Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
@Towmater

Those flippers make the signed books available to people who could not attend the cons.

Just as the promotors are doing something you enjoy for a profit the flippers are providing a service for others.

There are many people making a living from comics and all of them are supporting the hobby we enjoy.


That's like saying Wal-Mart is feeding people. Yes, you can shop there for food but they are driven by profit. Just like Joe Flipper guy. The difference is that all Wal-Marts have a business license, pay property tax, provide jobs to the community they are in, and return the sales tax they collect. Also, I've never been in a Wal-Mart that jacked the price of an item up continuously because it was the favor of the moment.
Post 101 IP   flag post
Collector Sebastsk8 private msg quote post Address this user
@Towmater I have a strong feeling the flipper market will quickly diminish next year with the new tax rules. As of now it's fairly easy to let those profits be unseen by the IRS, next year...not so much, and it will eat into their profit margin hugely to the point where it probably won't be worthwhile.
Post 102 IP   flag post
I'm good with splotches. Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastsk8
@Towmater I have a strong feeling the flipper market will quickly diminish next year with the new tax rules. As of now it's fairly easy to let those profits be unseen by the IRS, next year...not so much, and it will eat into their profit margin hugely to the point where it probably won't be worthwhile.


This is an excellent point.
Post 103 IP   flag post
Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
Quote:
Originally Posted by drchaos
@Towmater

Those flippers make the signed books available to people who could not attend the cons.

Just as the promotors are doing something you enjoy for a profit the flippers are providing a service for others.

There are many people making a living from comics and all of them are supporting the hobby we enjoy.


That's like saying Wal-Mart is feeding people. Yes, you can shop there for food but they are driven by profit. Just like Joe Flipper guy. The difference is that all Wal-Marts have a business license, pay property tax, provide jobs to the community they are in, and return the sales tax they collect. Also, I've never been in a Wal-Mart that jacked the price of an item up continuously because it was the favor of the moment.


I think flippers provide an important liquidity service. Pretty much the same way that ticket scalpers do. They are a bridge between two parties that would not have found each other otherwise. The profit they make needs to justify the risk that they take. I'm sure I've sold to flippers, bought from flippers, even been a bit of a flipper at times. If they go away, there will be a loss of liquidity in the market. This will erode value. Liquidity is important to confidence. The less confident someone is about selling a book down the road, the less confident they will be about buying a book. Legitimate Collectors included.
Post 104 IP   flag post
Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
@Sebastsk8 I'm old school, nothing aggravates me more than seeing a person stroll up with a stack of comics for a creator to sign. It means that the line is going to be held up longer. 2 or 3 books should be the max.


Anything more than 2 books and the creator should sign with their off hand. Assuming the person is not paying for the signatures.
Actually, one thing we haven't thought about is that the guy with the short box to be signed may not be just a random person. If the creator is signing for free then they have likely recieved a fee to be at the show. The guy with the big stack may be associated with the show or may have purchased some kind of VIP arrangement through the show that helped to subsidize the cost of the creator being there.
Post 105 IP   flag post


Collector* Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
@EbayMafia So, it's OK for a VIP to be an inconsiderate DB and dump a short box on a creator to hold up the line and aggravate the rest of the attendees with longer wait times and the possibility of not getting to meet them?

My understanding is that many of the creators that the promoters bring in to regional or local shows are given a flat fee for the show and hotel. Their sales count against that fee. So, if the promoter agrees to pay them 5000.00 at the end of the weekend to attend and they sell $12000.00 worth of autographs, books, photo-ops, or whatever then they make 12000.00. If they only sell 2000.00 then the promoter pays them the difference of $3K.

I can't speak for any creator that is brought in to sign books for free.
Post 106 IP   flag post
Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
@EbayMafia So, it's OK for a VIP to be an inconsiderate DB and dump a short box on a creator to hold up the line and aggravate the rest of the attendees with longer wait times and the possibility of not getting to meet them?


That's not my call, I don't put on the shows. They can do what they deem to be best for their business. Sounds a lot like what's going on with my CBCS submissions. I don't like it, but it's a reality.
Post 107 IP   flag post
I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for. drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
@EbayMafia So, it's OK for a VIP to be an inconsiderate DB and dump a short box on a creator to hold up the line and aggravate the rest of the attendees with longer wait times and the possibility of not getting to meet them?

My understanding is that many of the creators that the promoters bring in to regional or local shows are given a flat fee for the show and hotel. Their sales count against that fee. So, if the promoter agrees to pay them 5000.00 at the end of the weekend to attend and they sell $12000.00 worth of autographs, books, photo-ops, or whatever then they make 12000.00. If they only sell 2000.00 then the promoter pays them the difference of $3K.

I can't speak for any creator that is brought in to sign books for free.


Everything is negotiated.

Some artists get everything paid and others have to pay for their table.

There really is no standard deal that I am aware of.
Post 108 IP   flag post
I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for. drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by EbayMafia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
@Sebastsk8 I'm old school, nothing aggravates me more than seeing a person stroll up with a stack of comics for a creator to sign. It means that the line is going to be held up longer. 2 or 3 books should be the max.


Anything more than 2 books and the creator should sign with their off hand. Assuming the person is not paying for the signatures.
Actually, one thing we haven't thought about is that the guy with the short box to be signed may not be just a random person. If the creator is signing for free then they have likely recieved a fee to be at the show. The guy with the big stack may be associated with the show or may have purchased some kind of VIP arrangement through the show that helped to subsidize the cost of the creator being there.


The guy with the big stack of books may also be buying from dealers and commissioning sketches from artists at the show.

Even if the artists signing the books does not charge the flipper is could supporting the show in other ways.

Also, that stack of books did not fall out of the sky.

Each book was purchased from a store, dealer, or collector helping our hobby grow.
Post 109 IP   flag post
I had no way of knowing that 9.8 graded copies signed by Adam Hughes weren't what you were looking for. drchaos private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Towmater
@EbayMafia So, it's OK for a VIP to be an inconsiderate DB and dump a short box on a creator to hold up the line and aggravate the rest of the attendees with longer wait times and the possibility of not getting to meet them?

My understanding is that many of the creators that the promoters bring in to regional or local shows are given a flat fee for the show and hotel. Their sales count against that fee. So, if the promoter agrees to pay them 5000.00 at the end of the weekend to attend and they sell $12000.00 worth of autographs, books, photo-ops, or whatever then they make 12000.00. If they only sell 2000.00 then the promoter pays them the difference of $3K.

I can't speak for any creator that is brought in to sign books for free.


Those VIP passes aren't cheap and are a big money maker for the promoters.

I am not a fan of the practice and have been stuck behind the VIPs myself.

Someone with a large number of books will only hold up the line so much.

The chatty ones who hold up the line for 20 minutes are a bigger cause for lines taking longer.
Post 110 IP   flag post
Collector* Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
@drchaos In the end, you look at people with short boxes who clog lines at conventions positively and I look at their inconsiderate actions as being a negative. I believe we have read what the other thinks and have provided our views. Cool beans.
Post 111 IP   flag post
Masculinity takes a holiday. EbayMafia private msg quote post Address this user
I've noticed a pattern on forums that people believe they appear more clever by allowing no room for nuance or qualifiers in other peoples statements. They think other people see "clever" when in fact what other people see is obtuse and rigid.
Post 112 IP   flag post
Collector* Towmater private msg quote post Address this user
I've noticed that many flippers don't understand that others attend conventions for reasons besides making money. When one takes those blinders off the hobby is just a hobby. Maybe the return to common decency and politeness will return. Maybe then children will be seen a creator's booths. Maybe books that are common will return to sensible pricing levels. Maybe, just maybe.

Generally, I don't fault others for attempting to make a profit. However, flippers and speculators have made the hobby extremely expensive to be in or to start. I cannot wait for the market correction that we are experiencing to accelerate and drive those individuals into other markets. Building my son's collection will be a more enjoyable experience,
Post 113 IP   flag post
I'm good with splotches. Nuffsaid111 private msg quote post Address this user
The general theme, here; about loss of care for fellow individual, respect for others, awareness of surroundings, general decency is definitely a good one and is much diminished in recent times.

It exists within the comic convention halls; and it certainly exists outside the walls of the convention halls.

These days, people just don't give a rats @ss about how their actions impact those behind them, those around them and are utterly clueless/lack respect in their direct and indirect dealings with others.
Post 114 IP   flag post
598060 114 14
This topic is archived. Start new topic?