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Collector DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46


Oh stop. You can't claim the guy was able to do wonderful and marvelous things on the one hand, and then claim he was completely powerless to do anything about atrocity on the other.

It's double-speak.

Since when has political "pressure" ever forced anyone to do ANYTHING against which they, themselves, are morally opposed...? Especially since you claim FDR was a great crusader for minority rights...?

You can't claim that, and then put UNITED STATES CITIZENS in PRISON CAMPS because they or their ancestors are of a certain race/ethnicity/nationality.

Sorry.
Post 76 • IP   flag post
Collector DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer

My point simply was, the right hate FDR for exactly what the Left love him for. He did bad things. He did good things. Neither side seems to ever want to admit both.


Here are just my quotes from this very thread, posts made very recently. You tell me if "neither side seems to ever want to admit both" is a fair charge, as far as my comments have been concerned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
He was another person who was "the smartest guy in the room." That was TRUE...


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
As a war president, he was fantastic


If you are going to participate in these discussions, you need to show THE ENTIRE FORUM the respect and courtesy of paying very close attention to what people say and not make statements like the above, which clearly demonstrate that you weren't.

I don't classify myself as part of "the right", but I don't "hate" FDR. That's the type of inflammatory rhetoric that makes these discussions so volatile. It's an emotional reaction, and leads to charges of emotional reactions. Just because you disagree with someone, and think their policies were bad, doesn't mean you "hate" them. Not everything needs to be reduced to an emotional response.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SB


SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.

Socialism is not the answer. Absolute freedom is not the answer either. Trump was the first candidate I've seen who walked the midddle; its too bad he's got mental problems, he could have done great things.


No one, at any time, has said anything about "Absolute freedom" being the answer.

That is an example of a "straw man argument": inventing something that someone else said, then arguing against it as if that other person said it.

If you don't understand, or are unclear about, the position of someone, it's far superior to ask questions, rather than "assign" them a position based on your own opinions.

"Absolute freedom" is anarchy, and anarchy doesn't exist except for very short periods of time (think days, at most, if not hours), whereby the stronger flex their power and restore their own control over things.

INDIVIDUALISM...which respects the rights of the INDIVIDUAL over any group, minority, plurality, or majority...is the key to human success, and always has been. INDIVIDUALISM is neither Left NOR Right...it is CONSERVATISM.

Group think, or "Statism", as repeated by CAK, is what leads to human suffering, always.

As for Trump...he's not "walking the middle"; he's a moderate leftist, and always has been, regardless of what he calls himself. That is why the Left's screeching about him is so hilarious AND disturbing: he's one of them.
Post 77 • IP   flag post
Collector KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer

My point simply was, the right hate FDR for exactly what the Left love him for. He did bad things. He did good things. Neither side seems to ever want to admit both.


Here are just my quotes from this very thread, posts made very recently. You tell me if "neither side seems to ever want to admit both" is a fair charge, as far as my comments have been concerned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
He was another person who was "the smartest guy in the room." That was TRUE...


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
As a war president, he was fantastic


If you are going to participate in these discussions, you need to show THE ENTIRE FORUM the respect and courtesy of paying very close attention to what people say and not make statements like the above, which clearly demonstrate that you weren't.

I don't classify myself as part of "the right", but I don't "hate" FDR. That's the type of inflammatory rhetoric that makes these discussions so volatile. It's an emotional reaction, and leads to charges of emotional reactions. Just because you disagree with someone, and think their policies were bad, doesn't mean you "hate" them. Not everything needs to be reduced to an emotional response.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SB


SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.

Socialism is not the answer. Absolute freedom is not the answer either. Trump was the first candidate I've seen who walked the midddle; its too bad he's got mental problems, he could have done great things.


No one, at any time, has said anything about "Absolute freedom" being the answer.

That is an example of a "straw man argument": inventing something that someone else said, then arguing against it as if that other person said it.

If you don't understand, or are unclear about, the position of someone, it's far superior to ask questions, rather than "assign" them a position based on your own opinions.

"Absolute freedom" is anarchy, and anarchy doesn't exist except for very short periods of time (think days, at most, if not hours), whereby the stronger flex their power and restore their own control over things.

INDIVIDUALISM...which respects the rights of the INDIVIDUAL over any group, minority, plurality, or majority...is the key to human success, and always has been. INDIVIDUALISM is neither Left NOR Right...it is CONSERVATISM.

Group think, or "Statism", as repeated by CAK, is what leads to human suffering, always.

As for Trump...he's not "walking the middle"; he's a moderate leftist, and always has been, regardless of what he calls himself. That is why the Left's screeching about him is so hilarious AND disturbing: he's one of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46


Oh stop. You can't claim the guy was able to do wonderful and marvelous things on the one hand, and then claim he was completely powerless to do anything about atrocity on the other.

It's double-speak.

Since when has political "pressure" ever forced anyone to do ANYTHING against which they, themselves, are morally opposed...? Especially since you claim FDR was a great crusader for minority rights...?

You can't claim that, and then put UNITED STATES CITIZENS in PRISON CAMPS because they or their ancestors are of a certain race/ethnicity/nationality.

Sorry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
@Homer Ya I agree. Also I didn't mention this before I had a promo from ebay. Sell 10 items with NO Final Value Fees. So I sold that X-men with ZERO ebay fees.

Theoretically, if I sold it for $4k. The ebay+paypal fees would have been $520 on a normal ebay sale, $3480 net.


KingNampa, it would have been nice of you to post up that promo, BEFORE, the fact.Not after the promo ended.

Just sayin.


Why? If it was to take advantage of it, as km said, everyone gets different promos. That's why the "this promo is worth so and so!!" threads aren't very useful: everyone's promos are different.


My apologies to King Nampa, I waa wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46
Post 78 • IP   flag post
Collector DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer

SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.


By the way...there's no such thing as "both sides" as far as Washington politics is concerned. There is only The Left, as expressed by Bernie Sanders, Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, Hillary Clinton, and the like, and then there is the Slightly Less Left, as expressed by Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, Trump, and the like.

There are very, very, VERY few conservatives in Washington, mostly because it takes balls of steel to stand up to the political Establishment...which Trump has found out...which seeks nothing but to preserve its power, and so, will aggressively and persistently paint ANYONE who threatens their power in ANY way as evil, bad, wrong, evil, deplorable, vicious, uncaring, evil, mean, and evil.

The rest of these people are committed Statists, committed to doing one thing, and one thing only: expanding the power of the central government, and, by extension, their own power.

The Founders understood human nature. They fought hard to make their compatriots and descendants understand it, too. Most Americans don't understand that now, and think that central control is the solution to all of man's problems.

Nothing could be further from the truth.
Post 79 • IP   flag post
Collector DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer

My point simply was, the right hate FDR for exactly what the Left love him for. He did bad things. He did good things. Neither side seems to ever want to admit both.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer

My point simply was, the right hate FDR for exactly what the Left love him for. He did bad things. He did good things. Neither side seems to ever want to admit both.


Here are just my quotes from this very thread, posts made very recently. You tell me if "neither side seems to ever want to admit both" is a fair charge, as far as my comments have been concerned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
He was another person who was "the smartest guy in the room." That was TRUE...


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
As a war president, he was fantastic


If you are going to participate in these discussions, you need to show THE ENTIRE FORUM the respect and courtesy of paying very close attention to what people say and not make statements like the above, which clearly demonstrate that you weren't.

I don't classify myself as part of "the right", but I don't "hate" FDR. That's the type of inflammatory rhetoric that makes these discussions so volatile. It's an emotional reaction, and leads to charges of emotional reactions. Just because you disagree with someone, and think their policies were bad, doesn't mean you "hate" them. Not everything needs to be reduced to an emotional response.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SB


SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.

Socialism is not the answer. Absolute freedom is not the answer either. Trump was the first candidate I've seen who walked the midddle; its too bad he's got mental problems, he could have done great things.


No one, at any time, has said anything about "Absolute freedom" being the answer.

That is an example of a "straw man argument": inventing something that someone else said, then arguing against it as if that other person said it.

If you don't understand, or are unclear about, the position of someone, it's far superior to ask questions, rather than "assign" them a position based on your own opinions.

"Absolute freedom" is anarchy, and anarchy doesn't exist except for very short periods of time (think days, at most, if not hours), whereby the stronger flex their power and restore their own control over things.

INDIVIDUALISM...which respects the rights of the INDIVIDUAL over any group, minority, plurality, or majority...is the key to human success, and always has been. INDIVIDUALISM is neither Left NOR Right...it is CONSERVATISM.

Group think, or "Statism", as repeated by CAK, is what leads to human suffering, always.

As for Trump...he's not "walking the middle"; he's a moderate leftist, and always has been, regardless of what he calls himself. That is why the Left's screeching about him is so hilarious AND disturbing: he's one of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46


Oh stop. You can't claim the guy was able to do wonderful and marvelous things on the one hand, and then claim he was completely powerless to do anything about atrocity on the other.

It's double-speak.

Since when has political "pressure" ever forced anyone to do ANYTHING against which they, themselves, are morally opposed...? Especially since you claim FDR was a great crusader for minority rights...?

You can't claim that, and then put UNITED STATES CITIZENS in PRISON CAMPS because they or their ancestors are of a certain race/ethnicity/nationality.

Sorry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
@Homer Ya I agree. Also I didn't mention this before I had a promo from ebay. Sell 10 items with NO Final Value Fees. So I sold that X-men with ZERO ebay fees.

Theoretically, if I sold it for $4k. The ebay+paypal fees would have been $520 on a normal ebay sale, $3480 net.


KingNampa, it would have been nice of you to post up that promo, BEFORE, the fact.Not after the promo ended.

Just sayin.


Why? If it was to take advantage of it, as km said, everyone gets different promos. That's why the "this promo is worth so and so!!" threads aren't very useful: everyone's promos are different.


My apologies to King Nampa, I waa wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
He was another person who was "the smartest guy in the room." That was TRUE...


Quote:
Originally Posted by DB
As a war president, he was fantastic


If you are going to participate in these discussions, you need to show THE ENTIRE FORUM the respect and courtesy of paying very close attention to what people say and not make statements like the above, which clearly demonstrate that you weren't.

I don't classify myself as part of "the right", but I don't "hate" FDR. That's the type of inflammatory rhetoric that makes these discussions so volatile. It's an emotional reaction, and leads to charges of emotional reactions. Just because you disagree with someone, and think their policies were bad, doesn't mean you "hate" them. Not everything needs to be reduced to an emotional response.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SB


SS is ruined because of both sides raping it. Yes, both sides.

Socialism is not the answer. Absolute freedom is not the answer either. Trump was the first candidate I've seen who walked the midddle; its too bad he's got mental problems, he could have done great things.


No one, at any time, has said anything about "Absolute freedom" being the answer.

That is an example of a "straw man argument": inventing something that someone else said, then arguing against it as if that other person said it.

If you don't understand, or are unclear about, the position of someone, it's far superior to ask questions, rather than "assign" them a position based on your own opinions.

"Absolute freedom" is anarchy, and anarchy doesn't exist except for very short periods of time (think days, at most, if not hours), whereby the stronger flex their power and restore their own control over things.

INDIVIDUALISM...which respects the rights of the INDIVIDUAL over any group, minority, plurality, or majority...is the key to human success, and always has been. INDIVIDUALISM is neither Left NOR Right...it is CONSERVATISM.

Group think, or "Statism", as repeated by CAK, is what leads to human suffering, always.

As for Trump...he's not "walking the middle"; he's a moderate leftist, and always has been, regardless of what he calls himself. That is why the Left's screeching about him is so hilarious AND disturbing: he's one of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46


Oh stop. You can't claim the guy was able to do wonderful and marvelous things on the one hand, and then claim he was completely powerless to do anything about atrocity on the other.

It's double-speak.

Since when has political "pressure" ever forced anyone to do ANYTHING against which they, themselves, are morally opposed...? Especially since you claim FDR was a great crusader for minority rights...?

You can't claim that, and then put UNITED STATES CITIZENS in PRISON CAMPS because they or their ancestors are of a certain race/ethnicity/nationality.

Sorry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNampa
@Homer Ya I agree. Also I didn't mention this before I had a promo from ebay. Sell 10 items with NO Final Value Fees. So I sold that X-men with ZERO ebay fees.

Theoretically, if I sold it for $4k. The ebay+paypal fees would have been $520 on a normal ebay sale, $3480 net.


KingNampa, it would have been nice of you to post up that promo, BEFORE, the fact.Not after the promo ended.

Just sayin.


Why? If it was to take advantage of it, as km said, everyone gets different promos. That's why the "this promo is worth so and so!!" threads aren't very useful: everyone's promos are different.


My apologies to King Nampa, I waa wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocBrown
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrewbeer
Oh god. Doc calling FDR terrible, CAK calling him Bernie...

It's always interesting to see the far left and far right offer up their absolutes 😂


Couple of things in response:

1. I am not a member of the "far right." Most people in the US who use that term have no real conception of what "far right" actually means, because of the corruption of its use by the Left and its "mainstream" media spokesmen. The political spectrum is not a line...it is a circle. The "far left" and the "far right" meet at the top, advancing the same goals...Statism...through different means. At the bottom is the INDIVIDUALIST, those who recognize that freedom works best when INDIVIDUAL...NOT majority and minority...rights are preserved and defended.

2. FDR was a terrible president. He was an elitist who thought that having compassion for people meant forcing the rest of the people, at gunpoint (because that is what taxation is) to pay for them, creating a welfare state with implications that echo down the decades. And, if people didn't agree with them, he'd simply pack the courts to get his way. He threatened to expand the Supremes from 9 to 13, something no other president before him had done, just so he could pick as many of them as possible. Before FDR...really, before his cousin, Teddy...the Presidency did NOT have the power it has now. FDR seized that power, and all presidents since, to one degree or another, have maintained it.

Read what I said again, and absorb it: FDR put people of asian, specifically Japanese, descent IN CAMPS for the duration of the war. That fact ALONE...usually ignored...puts him in the position of a "terrible president who abused and expanded his power to take away the rights of US CITIZENS."

Let me say that again: FDR put US CITIZENS of Japanese descent INTO PRISON CAMPS for the "crime" of being of Japanese descent.

Let me say it one more time: Franklin Delano Roosevelt put UNITED STATES CITIZENS into PRISON CAMPS because of their RACE.

That said, it's hard to listen to his speech before Congress on Dec 8, 1941, and not feel stirred by his powerful rhetoric before the nation. It's one of the best speeches a politician has ever made.

Put down the books we all read in grade school, and pick up books that offer a critical analysis of the man. He's not a god. He was just as flawed as the rest of us.

Measured responses, SB.


You and I obviously disagree with FDR's anti-trust and his New Deal.

No point in going back and forth on that.

FDR was SEVERELY LIMITED in regard to what he coukd do with the rights of blacks and Asians, because of the social climate of the 1940's.

Again, this link explains his actions, which were obviously NOT GOOD, but it was due to political pressure.

FDR's hand was forced on these issues, he had no little to no power to help the plight of non-white US citizens and immigrants.

Reference:

https://litigation-essentials.lexisnexis.com/webcd/app?action=DocumentDisplay&crawlid=1&doctype=cite&docid=77+Ohio+St.+L.J.+791&srctype=smi&srcid=3B15&key=81ab938b4a13ddd9f01c9cf918aede46


Is there a reason we're quoting for quoting's sake?
Post 80 • IP   flag post


Collector DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by CopperAgeKids


That is why our country is now ranked well below all other major countries, in terms of education, health care and technology.

The only thing the U.S. kicks ass on, is our military industrial complex.

This shows that your position on "what is best for yourself", paraphrased, is inherently flawed.


What does that sentence even mean...? You talk about how the US is now "ranked below all other major countries" (without even defining what a "major country" is...that is, it's just a talking point)...and then try and tie that into "what is best for yourself" is "inherently flawed."

You believe...because you've been told so by people you do, but ought not to, trust...that it is individual freedom that is the CAUSE of declining standards in the US. That is the OPPOSITE of reality. The reason we enjoy the standards that we do...why, in fact, the West enjoys the standards that it does...is BECAUSE OF, not IN SPITE OF, individual freedom.

Here's how people work: if you leave people alone, they will, in general, act in their best interests. If everyone is acting in their best interests, while respecting the right of everyone else to act in their best interests...that is, freedom...success happens. Innovation happens, commerce happens, education happens, lives are improved, society is improved, a nation is healthy.

Now, we have vast, vast swaths of Americans, of all people, who don't understand that INDIVIDUAL freedom is what has made ANY great nation great, and who openly advocate centralized control as the means to "more greatness."

It doesn't matter how smart you are...you can't run a gas station in Des Moines, IA, better than the guy who runs the gas station in Des Moines, IA...yet that's what centralized gov't tries to do.

A book you should read:

https://www.amazon.com/Give-Me-Break-Exposed-Hucksters/dp/0060529156

John Stossel's "Give Me A Break"

Quote:
Originally Posted by CAK
America is still the biggest super power in the world, but that equates to entirely nothing of benefit, to the overwhelming majority of Americans.

In fact, it is to our collective detriment.


More soundbites without explanation.

HOW is it to "our collective detriment" that the US is still the biggest super power in the world?

You know how it's to our BENEFIT?

I can type this...from the comfort of my own home...without fear that the police will break in, seize my computer, and jail me for voicing "political speech."

I can also type this on a brand new HP laptop that I bought for a cheap price at a local office supply store.

I can also type this with a belly full of nutritious, good food and not have to worry about where my next meal is coming from.

I can also type this without having to worry that my neighbors are going to break into my house, shoot me dead, and steal all of my stuff.

That's not true everywhere in the world.
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