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A new coat of paint - Restoration4309

Collector poka private msg quote post Address this user
@NilesPaine personally would depend on the comic and what it is for.

I might conserve it if having sentimental value or something worth saving
Post 26 • IP   flag post
Collector Philflound private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by doog
I have owned some crumbly, falling apart cool books. My idea to save them is to slab them, they will never get worse, just ignore the shards of paper in the slab.


That is not true. The book will continue to deteriorate regardless of whether it's in the slab or not.

Restoring a book will most likely drop the value, so unless you get a professional and want a very nice looking copy, most will suggest don't do it.

Removing the resto if only in small areas (opening tear seals, removing glue, scraping minor color touch) will usually drop the grade slightly but increase the value.

My suggestion is that if you can conserve the book so it doesn't further degrade, or degrades at a much slower pace (decades over a few years) then maybe go that route.
Post 27 • IP   flag post
Collector NilesPaine private msg quote post Address this user
Won't slabbing slow the degrading process down dramatically though?? And considering the new inner wells from both companies "never needing to be changed" wouldn't you think they'd preserve minimum for 15-20 years?? I don't really know??
Post 28 • IP   flag post
Collector comic_book_man private msg quote post Address this user
@NilesPaine

First off, happy birthday!

Secondly, my experience has always proven that the restored market is it's own animal and comparing unrestored to restored values/place/grades/etc is apples to oranges...

There are very few situations where I would buy an unrestored book to have it restored, but there are many situations in which getting an already restored book to improve upon the restoration further is applicable.

I feel there is a place for restored books, and a market but you must tread lightly.
There are really only 2 channels: buying a cheap-cost ultra-low-grade key-issue high-demand book with intent to restore OR buying a cheap-cost low-grade already-restored key-issue high-demand book with intent to restore further.

Those two paths are the only way I've ever made it out of the restored tunnel with any sort of "value" to show for the books I owned. I suppose there is 1 more (non-value) channel...in which you buy a restored book to hang it on your wall because it looks pretty - as the goal of restoration is to make it look more fresh and not everyone can afford even a low-grade copy of many unrestored key books.

A restored book is a cheap way to get a nice looking copy of a book you want, minus the "financial potential" in the majority of situations.
Post 29 • IP   flag post
Collector Krazywan private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by georgefoo
I agree with NilesPaine. The stigma attached to restored books tends to be highly negative and not directly proportional to the degree of restoration. Perhaps there is a business opportunity for CBCS to also grade the level of restoration??
cbcs already notes the restorations on the book minor, moderate, extensive
Post 30 • IP   flag post


Collector Krazywan private msg quote post Address this user
Also Happy Birthday Niles
Post 31 • IP   flag post
Collector IronMan private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by NilesPaine
Won't slabbing slow the degrading process down dramatically though?? And considering the new inner wells from both companies "never needing to be changed" wouldn't you think they'd preserve minimum for 15-20 years?? I don't really know??


When you speak of the "degrading process", I'll assume you speak of the ongoing chemical reactions that occur in newsprint - a result of it being low quality paper made from the entire tree. Which contains a lot of containments that overtime result in chemical reactions that break down paper. Slabbing doesn't actually slow down that degrading process. Ultimately, slabbing a book only protects it from being handled and the inner well is a more inert, archival material than the typical polyethylene or polypropylene plastic bags.

What does slow down the chemical reactions is storage conditions. Collectors can control this. The temperature and humidity ranges that human beings find comfortable are also good for paper. If you are comfortable - so are your comic books. If you feel hot and humid, so do your your books.
Post 32 • IP   flag post
Collector NilesPaine private msg quote post Address this user
@Krazywan
THANKS!!!!
@comic_book_man
Thanks!
I never looked at it that way. In terms of attaining books I may want to have in my collection. It does seem restored books sit on the Ebay sales I watch. I suppose though, it depends on a persons definition of acceptable restoration and what you're willing to accept. I'm sure as these books become more rare there will be some sort of demand for them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by NilesPaine
Won't slabbing slow the degrading process down dramatically though?? And considering the new inner wells from both companies "never needing to be changed" wouldn't you think they'd preserve minimum for 15-20 years?? I don't really know??


When you speak of the "degrading process", I'll assume you speak of the ongoing chemical reactions that occur in newsprint - a result of it being low quality paper made from the entire tree. Which contains a lot of containments that overtime result in chemical reactions that break down paper. Slabbing doesn't actually slow down that degrading process. Ultimately, slabbing a book only protects it from being handled and the inner well is a more inert, archival material than the typical polyethylene or polypropylene plastic bags.

What does slow down the chemical reactions is storage conditions. Collectors can control this. The temperature and humidity ranges that human beings find comfortable are also good for paper. If you are comfortable - so are your comic books. If you feel hot and humid, so do your your books.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by NilesPaine
Won't slabbing slow the degrading process down dramatically though?? And considering the new inner wells from both companies "never needing to be changed" wouldn't you think they'd preserve minimum for 15-20 years?? I don't really know??


When you speak of the "degrading process", I'll assume you speak of the ongoing chemical reactions that occur in newsprint - a result of it being low quality paper made from the entire tree. Which contains a lot of containments that overtime result in chemical reactions that break down paper. Slabbing doesn't actually slow down that degrading process. Ultimately, slabbing a book only protects it from being handled and the inner well is a more inert, archival material than the typical polyethylene or polypropylene plastic bags.

What does slow down the chemical reactions is storage conditions. Collectors can control this. The temperature and humidity ranges that human beings find comfortable are also good for paper. If you are comfortable - so are your comic books. If you feel hot and humid, so do your your books.


So I guess that's what I was fuzzy on. I know obviously a slab protects a book from wear and tear but does it actually prevent "air" and natural breakdown from occurring??? I guess not being that the seal isn't air tight but then to further that, would an airtight seal lessen degradation??? Also, thanks for the info
Post 33 • IP   flag post
Collector IronMan private msg quote post Address this user
No grading companies slabs are water or airtight. And actually it's the inner holder that is archival and resistant to the atmosphere. The outer holder is strictly for protection from handling.

Nor is it clear if airtight is desirable. CBCS states their slab is designed with some "breath-ability" on purpose. Newsprint naturally breaks down (out gassing) and one theory holds that the chemical reaction of that breaking down are best allowed to escape, rather than be trapped. CGC uses a paper insert called microchamber paper that supposedly absorbs and binds these out gassing chemicals

The science of all of that gets pretty....debatable. I've participated in the debate many a time. Sealed or not sealed, MCP or none - actual tests don't show a lot of difference. The tests that do show differences are sketchy.


What is NOT DEBATABLE is the benefits of good storage conditions. Keep your paper collectibles at 50-75 degrees Fahrenheit and humidity at 30-50% and you are doing a lot to keep the chemical reactions to a minimum. What is even more important than being in the range is having the range not swing a lot. So as I've said before, if you air-condition your house in the summer and heat it in the winter, you really are doing quite well storage wise.
Post 34 • IP   flag post
Collector NilesPaine private msg quote post Address this user
@IronMan
Good info. My comics are well kept. Bt that another interesting thing to think about. If you DONT keep your comics in decent conditions, I'd wonder if the slab would help against or contribute to ruining the comic. I feel like shifts from extreme hot to cold or humidity inside the holder would make for a more dangerous build up of condensation. No idea factually but that would be my assumption.
Post 35 • IP   flag post
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