CBCS Case Swap video Real?3983
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shrewbeer private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Wiping things clean is not CBCS' MO. You're thinking of the other guys   |
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| Post 76 • IP flag post | ||
 Moderator
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Jesse_O private msg quote post Address this user | |
| The video has NOT been deleted from the Collectors Club. The video has actually been deleted off of youtube. | ||
| Post 77 • IP flag post | ||
 Ima gonna steal this and look for some occasion to use it!
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IronMan private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Torrey has since pulled this video off of youtube. Since the video has been taken down so have my comments and I don't feel like repeating them all. A short version would be... 1) Torrey's comments are disingenuous. He doesn't not use CBCS because the slab isn't tamper proof.. He uses CGC because he's a signature facilitator and CGC demands exclusivity in such. He has to make a choice between the two. A couple of signature facilitating companies formed sister companies (Desert Wind and Celestial Comics) just so they could .represent CGC and CBCS. 2) While the video "proves" that it's possible( to tamper a CBCS slab it makes it look both way easier to do and way harder to detect than it is), it also proves that the slab CGC used their first 16 years they were n business and for 3 million plus books is even more easy to tamper with. This is where the disingenuous part comes in. Torrey has been a CGC facilitator for a long time. Including the e time period from JUly 2014 to June 2016 where CBCS clearly had the SUPERIOR, more tamper resistant slab. Torrey was a CGC facilitator during this time too. So it has NOTHING to do with the slabs and their tamper resistance and EVERYTHING to do with business. Maybe he gets some requests for getting signatures for CBCS. Instead of saying "I can't do this, CGC won't let me, I recommend xxxx", instead it's played as a quality thing. I've used Torrey as a facilitator and been happy with his services. I've recommended him to others who have used his services. But the video is unwarranted and deceptive and there is a reason he's yanking it. IDK for sure why it was posted and why it's being taken down, but it's deceptive. I could go on and on. but I'll just close with this. This is obviously a CBCS friendly forum. But even the most ferocious CGC fanboy ought to recognize they owe a big thank you to CBCS. CGC is a remarkably and demonstrably BETTER company than what there were three years ago. BECAUSE of legitimate competition from CBCS. They talked for a decade about a better slab that addressed issues of tampering and clarity. Customers put up with wait times of 5-7 months for a decade. The modern tier was bumped up to 1980. Then competition came along and all of a sudden these things got done or improved. |
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DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by IronMan This, this, this. This times a million. Competition is the key to success for everyone. |
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| Post 79 • IP flag post | ||
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Jesse_O Ok, that is good to know. |
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| Post 80 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Ok, the video was shenanigans, and the video was pulled. Can we now stop talking about the video and focus on the real issue which is still a real issue? |
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| Post 81 • IP flag post | ||
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Ima gonna steal this and look for some occasion to use it!
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IronMan private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego There were a good number of comments on the YouTube video - including my own - that disappeared once the video was pulled. Just as an FYI - most of the comments (including my own) were rather critical of the video. ONE of the commentators called out Twin City Auctions (Torrey Quella) for posting the video on various FB pages as well as YouTube. I have never put a video up on YouTube so am unfamiliar with rules. But apparently if you post a video on YouTube then any further postings of the video are supposed to link back to the YouTube video. Not be a separate post/hosting. I've looked over the Comic book FB groups I belong to and don't see the video. Except as a link to YouTube. If anyone finds such please post it here, as I want to challenge it where ever it appears. |
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| Post 82 • IP flag post | ||
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Ima gonna steal this and look for some occasion to use it!
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IronMan private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Sure. But understand this..... The video also "PROVES" that over three million comics slabbed by CGC prior to April 2016 are even more vulnerable to tampering. Because the slabs were only "sealed" at four tiny corner posts and the label was not sealed up inside the inner label. With CGC's Generation 1 slab - used for 16+ years and at least three million comics, it was in fact much less tamper resistant than CBCS's holder. The video made it look quick and easy to pop the top rail and clips and remove the outer holder on CBCS books. I've unslabbled lots CBCS books. It is not quick and not easy. If you do it quick (a pair of pliers) the clips crack every time. You probably could use say a heat gun to make the plastic looser and more flexible. But that takes more time than the video shows. Then their is the issue of the sealed inner well. The video focus was soft and had almost no close ups. But in the one close up on the newly minted 9.8, you could if you looked closely see that the inner well had been trimmed open. So here is a tip. IF it LOOKS LIKE the inner well has been cut open along the top of - walk away. Perfect should not be allowed to be the enemy of good. CBCS's slab was a clear improvement over CGC's slab when it was introduced in July 2014. Three years later CGC caught up and some might argue has the better slab. It is debatable. Do you wish to trade tamperproof for Newton rings?. Tamperproff for so hard to get out of the slab the book might be damaged? Regardless of the answer, CGC's new slab is more tamper resistant than CGC's old slab and CBCS's current slab. BETTER is debatable. Competition between legitimate grading companies is good for the consumer. That's it. Maybe CBCS will tweak their slab in the future. Maybe they will decide their slab strikes the best balance. But we'll all benefit. |
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| Post 83 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I was well aware of how easy the old CGC slab was, I thought that was common knowledge for anyone who cared. Which slab is best right now is kind of irrelevant imo. I think the real question should be this. If the serious concerns of people can be solved by four dabs of glue? Then why resist actually solving that concern? And if that isn't logistically feasible, let's hear a solution that is. I'm looking forward to the response from CBCS. This isn't something that would stop me from submitting books, but it dang sure is something that will effect how I purchase slabbed books from other people going forward. |
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| Post 84 • IP flag post | ||
 CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Four dabs of glue are not the answer. We tested this when we started up, and here were our observations... 1) We were concerned about the possible effects of the glue off-gassing. 2) We made samples of cases with the clips glued and showed them to test subjects, without their knowledge. The subjects commented that the spot where the glue was looked like a crack in the case. 3) We had concerns of putting a liquid, especially glue, anywhere near someone's comic book because that is an accident waiting to happen. We don't even let employees have drinks on surfaces near comics. We determined that just wasn't in the best interest of the company. We're always working to improve our product and procedures. As mentioned earlier in the thread, the labels are now sealed into the inner well with a small tab. This was by design in effort to make it harder for nefarious individuals to tamper with the holder. |
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| Post 85 • IP flag post | ||
 I bought a meat grinder on amazon for $60 and it's changed my life.
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kaptainmyke private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Well said. | ||
| Post 86 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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ComicWiz private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I agree with Steve. Glue isn't a solution here. The presence of glue would only introduce concerns of tampering. | ||
| Post 87 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @SteveRicketts How about the tamper sticker you use on raw grades? Can that be applied to the slabs? | ||
| Post 88 • IP flag post | ||
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CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by KingNampa Something very similar was on the R&D table at one time. It did have promise. Maybe it can be revisited. We do appreciate your ideas. |
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| Post 89 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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ComicWiz private msg quote post Address this user | |
| We used to use an asset management solution on expensive laptops. It functioned like a sticker, they were serialized, and "tattoo'd" on to the case. There was no way they could be removed without it showing it was tampered with. This is kind of the same idea: http://www.computersecurity.com/stop/. It can be made more discreet, translucent, and placed on the seam joining the two sides of bottom/top edges of the hard outer shells. | ||
| Post 90 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SteveRicketts Maybe something similar to this?  |
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| Post 91 • IP flag post | ||
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CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
| In case you guys didn't see this; Steve Paulus posted this on the Facebook thread... Quote: Originally Posted by Steve Paulus |
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| Post 92 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @SteveRicketts Thanks for the responses. I think besides the lack of tamper evidence on the tabs, CBCS cases are the best designed. I'm hoping something can be done to remedy that in the future. #soon. | ||
| Post 93 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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DocBrown private msg quote post Address this user | |
| And, if it needs to be said, this is also another argument for why it is important for people putting any kind of money in slabs to have basic grading skills themselves, and not just rely wholly on the number on the label. A typical 9.0 is going to be quite obviously different from a typical 9.8, and if a buyer knows this, he/she will be much less likely to get taken advantage of in this way. The grading companies want customers to agree with them, not merely take their word for it. A knowledgeable customer base is a stable customer base. |
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| Post 94 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Steve Paulus This is something I was not previously aware of. I had noticed it before, but I didn't realize it was an intentional security measure. This is reassuring information. |
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| Post 95 • IP flag post | ||
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CBCS Pressing
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SteveRicketts private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DarthLego Yes, we did it so if someone pulls the label out, there will be a tear on it. |
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| Post 96 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by SteveRicketts Just advertise that feature, not really concerned about tamper stickers now.  |
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| Post 97 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user | |
@DarthLego I get it now. The outer case is more for protection. The inner well and label is what needs to be tamper-proofed and sealed to maintain the authenticity of the grading.  |
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| Post 98 • IP flag post | ||
 Collector
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RexMuff private msg quote post Address this user | |
Seems to me that precautions have been taken to prevent this sort of tom-foolery, so the issue is...has CBC begun to panic and "hire" secret agents to propagate a false sense of distrust in its competition?  |
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| Post 99 • IP flag post | ||
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Collector
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KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have a bunch of unused CBCS cases that are intact. Can I return them to CBCS for a credit or something? Like recycling cans, etc. | ||
| Post 100 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by RexMuff Fixed that for you. |
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| Post 101 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Ok, now the even more serious question! Where is Jake? |
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| Post 102 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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shrewbeer private msg quote post Address this user | |
I thought the label was just sealed in, and thought that was good enough. Having the label sealed like that to guarantee a tear if it is messed with is just genious. I, (and many others it seems) had no idea of this feature. This thread has proved its value   |
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| Post 103 • IP flag post | ||
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COLLECTOR
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DarthLego private msg quote post Address this user | |
| How long ago was this started? I do have some new labels where it is not there. | ||
| Post 104 • IP flag post | ||
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KingNampa private msg quote post Address this user | |
@SteveRicketts Quote:Originally Posted by SteveRicketts Hey Steve, could you please tell us when this process started? Some new label comics don't have that seal on the labels. |
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